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Do incapacitations count as a soldier's kills?

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paratmar

Rep: 24.3
votes: 3


PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2022 5:15 am Post subject: Re: War in Ukraine? Reply with quote

21+ https://vk.com/video-25189118_456248288
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JFFulcrum

Rep: 67.1


PostPosted: Tue Apr 05, 2022 7:48 pm Post subject: Re: War in Ukraine? Reply with quote

Video of 'strike' on Berdiansk port of 24 march: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IkfzmglTxyM  . No signs of air- or missile strike on video. The large amphibious ship "Saratov' likely was a total loss, becoming first russian warship lost in wartime since 1945.
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mooxe

Rep: 211.2
votes: 25


PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2022 12:27 am Post subject: Re: War in Ukraine? Reply with quote

Yeap pretty sure I said a few posts back the Russians sunk it themselves!!


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pvt_Grunt

Rep: 93.2
votes: 5


PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2022 9:55 am Post subject: Re: War in Ukraine? Reply with quote

The Battle of Kyiv has been won by the Ukrainian army. The Russian army has retreated after great losses.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Kyiv_(2022)
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pvt_Grunt

Rep: 93.2
votes: 5


PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2022 10:52 am Post subject: Re: War in Ukraine? Reply with quote

paratmar wrote (View Post):
"Facts" do not exist. There is only their interpretation.


This is the most ridiculous Orwellian bullshit I've heard yet!
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paratmar

Rep: 24.3
votes: 3


PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2022 12:08 pm Post subject: Re: War in Ukraine? Reply with quote

pvt_Grunt wrote (View Post):
The Battle of Kyiv has been won by the Ukrainian army. The Russian army has retreated after great losses.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Kyiv_(2022)

Nothing more than this bulshit
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mooxe

Rep: 211.2
votes: 25


PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2022 8:34 pm Post subject: Re: War in Ukraine? Reply with quote

pvt_Grunt wrote (View Post):
The Battle of Kyiv has been won by the Ukrainian army. The Russian army has retreated after great losses.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Kyiv_(2022)


The attack on Kiev was just a feint. There was never any intent at all to take the city and replace the government. This was never part of the Russian strategy. The Kiev attack was simply a way to draw resources away from Donbas.


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mooxe

Rep: 211.2
votes: 25


PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2022 8:42 pm Post subject: Re: War in Ukraine? Reply with quote

From the BBC as of 05 April 2022.


_124060281_ukrainian_pushback_05_04_640x2-nc.png
 Description:
 Filesize:  522.68 KB
 Viewed:  958 Time(s)

_124060281_ukrainian_pushback_05_04_640x2-nc.png




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dj

Rep: 144.1
votes: 8


PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2022 4:58 am Post subject: Re: War in Ukraine? Reply with quote

pvt_Grunt wrote (View Post):
paratmar wrote (View Post):
"Facts" do not exist. There is only their interpretation.


This is the most ridiculous Orwellian bullshit I've heard yet!


Yes and I saw the Russian media presented on MSNBC translated to English.

The Russian government-controlled media said word for word what's being posted on this thread.  Bucha massacres were staged lies from the Ukraine govt?  Nope, the evidence is clear.  It reminds me of when Stalin tried to blame the Germans for the Katyn executions in Poland.  Germans proved it was not them & journalists allowed to investigate.  Then decades later, the Soviet Union finally admitted ok yes we did it.

Don't think Kiev was a feint attack, not seeing much strategy by Russians.  I think Russians thought defenders would cave and they didn't.  Also Russians suffered heavy losses especially armor and they didn't want such high casualties again.
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paratmar

Rep: 24.3
votes: 3


PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2022 6:53 am Post subject: Re: War in Ukraine? Reply with quote

dj wrote (View Post):
pvt_Grunt wrote (View Post):
paratmar wrote (View Post):
"Facts" do not exist. There is only their interpretation.


This is the most ridiculous Orwellian bullshit I've heard yet!


Yes and I saw the Russian media presented on MSNBC translated to English.

The Russian government-controlled media said word for word what's being posted on this thread.  Bucha massacres were staged lies from the Ukraine govt?  Nope, the evidence is clear.  It reminds me of when Stalin tried to blame the Germans for the Katyn executions in Poland.  Germans proved it was not them & journalists allowed to investigate.  Then decades later, the Soviet Union finally admitted ok yes we did it.

Don't think Kiev was a feint attack, not seeing much strategy by Russians.  I think Russians thought defenders would cave and they didn't.  Also Russians suffered heavy losses especially armor and they didn't want such high casualties again.

Don't watch official media. We need to think for yourself. It's difficult but needest.
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JFFulcrum

Rep: 67.1


PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2022 4:32 pm Post subject: Re: War in Ukraine? Reply with quote

Despite step back was not a military, but political decision (some undercover agreements in Istanbul, in Russian called dogovornyak), it is still a dumb decision:

- Like in 1945 Soviet army near Berlin - oh, we tired, we never wanted to capture Berlin, let`s go home. Seriously?
- 150K Ukrainian army group was hold at Kyiv, now free to act, and may choose a decision to offence, including into Belarus or Russia. In Belgorod region local authorities already started making entrenchments on border.
- Bucha 'Dovzhenko' (Ukrainian Hollywood) was just a first swallow, now Ukraine can, and, likely, will find anything else on freed territories, world 1'st large stock of zarine, million raped ukrainian women, whatever.
- Every pro-russian forces inside Ukraine took a awful lesson, facing with bad consequences, one ukrainian official already confirmed reprisals against pro-russian (or claimed as) people after Russian army withdrawal. Now we will see no support for russian army, and even for new civilian authorities.
- Kiyv airports and Hostomel airbase can once again used for Ukrainian aviation, and maybe, by NATO planes in case of involvement, closer to Donbass.
- Zelensky and Arestovich freely walking around Kiyv https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iVeGXDYpBT8 . He don`t afraid anything, like guided missile - Dudaev, etc. That`s once again dogovornyak. Again, april 1945, Hitler and Goebbels leaving Reich Chancellery and walking on the streets. Soviet soldiers watch it in binoculars and like - Hey, they just walking around, it will be dishonorably to shoot.
- And, as expected, Ukraine dropped all public agreements in Istambul, including POW exchange.

The only good is stop of unneeded suffering of Kyiv civilian population.
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mooxe

Rep: 211.2
votes: 25


PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2022 10:15 pm Post subject: Re: War in Ukraine? Reply with quote

War is a political decision.

These political decisions can be based off of military performance.


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dj

Rep: 144.1
votes: 8


PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2022 4:12 am Post subject: Re: War in Ukraine? Reply with quote

Evidence has been collected, documented, photographed, video taped, German intelligence also intercepted Russian communications.  The Germans have the proof also.  Russia owns these war crimes now no escape, like in WW2 because they "won", they were not held accountable for these type of blood-thirsty atrocities.  

Russian media also becoming like Joseph Goebels propaganda to promote hatred of Ukraine, repeating the lies about "Nazi's" and how Russia is entitled to help themselves to invade sovereign nation.

https://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/possible-evidence-of-russian-atrocities-german-intelligence-intercepts-radio-traffic-discussing-the-murder-of-civilians-in-bucha-a-0a191c96-634f-4d07-8c5c-c4a772315b0d
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JFFulcrum

Rep: 67.1


PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2022 11:19 am Post subject: Re: War in Ukraine? Reply with quote

Quote:
https://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/possible-evidence-of-russian-atrocities-german-intelligence-intercepts-radio-traffic-discussing-the-murder-of-civilians-in-bucha-a-0a191c96-634f-4d07-8c5c-c4a772315b0d  

So Germans had radios. For a month already. But share the knowledge only now. It`s too early or too late? Or because quality of dish was not so good, and cook decided to add some salt? Nevermind, though.
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mooxe

Rep: 211.2
votes: 25


PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2022 4:00 pm Post subject: Re: War in Ukraine? Reply with quote

JFFulcrum wrote (View Post):
Quote:
https://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/possible-evidence-of-russian-atrocities-german-intelligence-intercepts-radio-traffic-discussing-the-murder-of-civilians-in-bucha-a-0a191c96-634f-4d07-8c5c-c4a772315b0d  

So Germans had radios. For a month already. But share the knowledge only now. It`s too early or too late? Or because quality of dish was not so good, and cook decided to add some salt? Nevermind, though.


You can consider all Russian unencrypted radio traffic as being recorded by multiple countries. It happened all throughout the Cold War.

This is standard procedure in an electronic warfare environment. In fact they probably have equipment that can narrow down where the transmissions originated, and in collaboration with intelligence can match voices and radio signatures to specific units and their movement.

The fact that Russia is using unencrypted radio transmissions in a war environment speaks to the obsolescence and incompetency of its military.


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JFFulcrum

Rep: 67.1


PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2022 5:01 pm Post subject: Re: War in Ukraine? Reply with quote

https://www.economist.com/the-economist-explains/2022/03/28/why-russian-radios-ukraine-war-intercepted-heavy-metal
 
So practically anyone can talk on that frequencies. Whatever he wants. And Ukranians already listen all the time.  Maybe talk too? Something needed...
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mooxe

Rep: 211.2
votes: 25


PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2022 6:10 pm Post subject: Re: War in Ukraine? Reply with quote

JFFulcrum wrote (View Post):
https://www.economist.com/the-economist-explains/2022/03/28/why-russian-radios-ukraine-war-intercepted-heavy-metal
 
So practically anyone can talk on that frequencies. Whatever he wants. And Ukranians already listen all the time.  Maybe talk too? Something needed...


Anyone can talk on any frequency if they have the right type of transmitter.

HF is a particularly bad to use unencrypted. HF signals if given enough power combined with the proper antenna can be transmitted world wide. BBC for example transmitted on HF frequencies during WW2 which is why you could tune into BBC pretty much all over the world. BBC did this for decades.

In the article you posted, Ukraine is spamming "jamming" by transmitting heavy metal music on frequencies Russians are using. Some enemy radio frequencies are good to listen to, and you can extract intelligence from them. Usually you would only jam enemy frequencies if causing communications disruptions were more valuable than the intelligence you could gain.


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dj

Rep: 144.1
votes: 8


PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2022 1:59 am Post subject: Re: War in Ukraine? Reply with quote

As in the case of the Katyn massacre, the International Media including EU President Leyen inspected grave sites at Bucha.  Professional criminal forensic investigation is being conducted.  As in the case of Katyn, they exhumed corpses from mass grave to collect and document evidence.
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dj

Rep: 144.1
votes: 8


PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2022 1:59 am Post subject: Re: War in Ukraine? Reply with quote

https://www.nytimespost.com/european-union-president-ursula-von-der-leyen-visits-ukraine-to-see-bucha-massacre-victims/
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JFFulcrum

Rep: 67.1


PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2022 8:33 am Post subject: Re: War in Ukraine? Reply with quote

Quote:
the International Media including EU President Leyen inspected grave sites at Bucha.


They all watched at claimed artillery strike at kindergarden in Luhanska Stanytsia in February, which was later revealed as complete ukrainian hoax. Some of journalist there had Afghan, Iraq, Syria experience, so they had first-hand knowledge how the results of heavy shell hit actually looks like. But nobody said a word against ukrainian official version. Same will be now. Already all western media agreed with official ukraine version of Kramatorsk railway station missile strike, while even ukrainian media asking questions, why the missile came from west and not east.
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