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Ardennes VetBoB for CC5 issues and changes.

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#1: Ardennes VetBoB for CC5 issues and changes. Author: Hicks,

Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 1:23 pm
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I had hard crashes with the initial version of Ardennes so downloaded this VetBoB version.

I went through the usual process of changing the sounds/weapons/medals files finding some real oddities in them and then did some more poking when deciding to replace the unit portraits with GJS style historical photos.

That's when I started to find headaches.

I've been going through the files fixing errors of weapon assignments [AA/AT guns using the wrong weapon, UK forces having US teams etc] and I've found a couple more issues.

I think I've got enough wiggle room to replace or add in weapons, UK 6pdr, US 75mm field gun for example.

Mortars are a mess. There are some smaller mortars 50/60mm which are crewed teams. The larger units are handled via a spotter that seems unable to fire indirectly [seems to nullify the usefulness of mortars in CC] though the trade-off is they have around 200+ rounds of ammunition. I'd like to return the mortars to being indirect fire, crewed weapons.

I should be able to make the changes for these as I was able to create mortar battery units for CC3. I've freed up some UI portraits for those teams also.

The rocket half-track is an easy fix of slowing the fire-rate and changing the ammunition capacity - as it stands it is carrying 48 rockets - where I don't know...

I'm not sure how to go about making some other changes however. AT rocket teams are unable to fire from within buildings which I would like to undo. They have back-blast enabled which makes sense. The building restriction though doesn't, I don't know how to make that adjustment.

#2: Re: Ardennes VetBoB for CC5 issues and changes. Author: ScnelleMeyer,

Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 1:41 pm
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Modding is much like trying to restore an old car. The more rusted metal you cut off the more issues you find and suddenly the car is in pieces before you.

Sound like you are deep into this one Hicks:) - Good job buddy. . It will be better when finnished.

The AT-rocket teams problem, -I recall reading about it somewhere before but cant remember. Best suggestion is to compare the weapons data from the mod to original game data and try to spot differences.

Also do the same with Teams.txt files.

#3: Re: Ardennes VetBoB for CC5 issues and changes. Author: Hicks,

Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 2:36 pm
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It's getting there, slowly but surely. She might be a little rusty at the moment but I'm hoping to have it shining by the time I'm finished :D

The A30 Challenger was giving me a headache for a while. It had a teams reference but no vehicle. It was listed as entry #126 but the listings end at 122. I was able to find the right entry though eventually.

The force pools are a bit strange as well with UK forces mixed in oddly where the seem like they shouldn't be. I'll give those battle-group files a look as well though it'll need some research to check.

There are a few of the GJS portraits included, most are fresh though. Sound is almost done thankfully, just some artillery pieces to do. They have the magazine and rounds per burst changed as well. Some of the burst fire values were very strange.

I'll take a look again to see what I can find with the AT teams in buildings. We're going to have some new headaches if things are vastly changed with file structures and modding in this new, in development CC game.

There are about 15 - 20 more US portraits to do and then the team monitor icons to do. Here are some of the portraits so far:

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#4: Re: Ardennes VetBoB for CC5 issues and changes. Author: mick_xe5,

Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 2:40 pm
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Setting the Weapons.adb - Backblast value (Col U) to 0 will allow AT teams to fire from bldgs. You wont be able to easily test this unless you also change the Valid Targets value to 6 (Vehicles and Terrain). Not sure about the Germans but US troops frequently targeted bldgs with bazookas.

#5: Re: Ardennes VetBoB for CC5 issues and changes. Author: ScnelleMeyer,

Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 2:58 pm
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Thanks for clearing up the back blast issue mick_xe5!

Hicks regarding strange stuff going on in the forcepool - In the original CC4 Vetbob only VETERAN vs VETERAN was playable so those where the only FP that worked properly.
This was most likely carried over to the CC5 version. - It is similar to CC4 Kreta that I started rebuilding for LSA a couple of years(!!) ago.

#6: Re: Ardennes VetBoB for CC5 issues and changes. Author: Hicks,

Posted: Sun Mar 18, 2018 4:26 pm
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Both M9 Rocket Launcher and Panzerschreck are set to have Backblast enabled in the files. The M9 can be fired from within buildings while the 'Schreck can't.

I'm copying the entries from GJS and Ardennes to see what is different in the files.

I think it has something to do with ranges. I've been able to get the Panzerschreck to work from in buildings at least now after swapping in the GJS details.

#7: Re: Ardennes VetBoB for CC5 issues and changes. Author: Hicks,

Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 11:03 am
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I've got all the unit portraits done now. The sound is all but done and most of the weapon and teams adjustments have been done also. Music is replaced, medals are replaced and GtC explosions are in - thanks to you know who :)

The UK forces now have a dedicated command unit, the force pools have been adjusted to change it so that forces are not intermixed where they shouldn't be. The 80/81mm mortars have been returned to being crewed, indirect fire weapons. The rocket carrier no longer has the huge pool of ammunition and has a slowed, more controllable fire rate. AT rockets are fire-able from within buildings also. I'm wondering if it's worth changing the panzerfausts so that they are not so readily used on infantry, but are saved for armour and vehicles?

I don't think I'll be able to make the 120mm mortar, 4.2' mortar or Nebelwerfer into crewed weapons without having space for new entries in the vehicles file. I'm not sure whether to make them a small 2/3 man direct fire team or keep them as one soldier - perhaps lowering the amount of ammunition they have also. Might also be worth having them fire a salvo of rounds? I can try to see if I can get them to work.

I've ran into a problem though. Does anyone know; what setting and where I need to adjust, to change the team monitor icons: the "GSUNIT_xxx" files, not the "BGUNITxxx_xxx" files? I've got the BGUNIT icon set to 180 and the GSUNIT is named 180 also. The BGUNIT file shows in game while the team monitor icon doesn't. The right files have been found Smile

Once they are done this should be finished.

#8: Re: Ardennes VetBoB for CC5 issues and changes. Author: Hicks,

Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 6:25 pm
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I think the bulk of the work is done on this. It has ended up being an overhaul mod of an overhaul mod... All because I couldn't get a map to load on the original Ardennes version :S

It'd be handy for another set of eyes to give it a look and a try though as there are bound to be things that I've missed.

I'm not sure how best to subdivide this when it comes to submitting as a sub mod though. Any ideas? The sound/music would work as separate bodies. The changes to teams etc are more intertwined with one another though.

Last edited by Hicks on Mon May 07, 2018 11:34 pm; edited 1 time in total

#9: Re: Ardennes VetBoB for CC5 issues and changes. Author: ScnelleMeyer,

Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 7:31 pm
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Great job wrapping it up Hicks!
DL it now mate. Looking forward to checking out your changes, but it might be a while before I get to play it much.

- There is a Winter War going on;)

#10: Re: Ardennes VetBoB for CC5 issues and changes. Author: Hicks,

Posted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 8:35 pm
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ScnelleMeyer wrote (View Post):

Great job wrapping it up Hicks!
DL it now mate. Looking forward to checking out your changes, but it might be a while before I get to play it much.

- There is a Winter War going on;)

Thank you! It amazes me the time that would be put into the making of these mods, not the lick of selective taste paint that I've given this, but the original creation. I've still to do the tweaks for the heavy mortars and nebelwerfer but for the most part it is done. Looking through the files and the amount of work that goes into the making of these, I've got to take my hat off to you all and the time that you put into creating them. Smile

I really don't envy you the work that I'd imagine is to go into porting Winter War. If I can help, let me know. I don't have Longest Day but should be able to make graphics/sounds etc if they are needed.

I'll get round to packaging up the medal graphics for a number of mods as well so if people would like to use them, they'll be available also.

#11: Re: Ardennes VetBoB for CC5 issues and changes. Author: Hicks,

Posted: Tue Mar 20, 2018 11:02 am
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I've tinkered with the nebelwerfer as a test bed for the heavier "spotter" teams.

As an indirect fire unit it is ridiculously powerful, the 200 rounds of ammunition make it even more ludicrous.

I want them to be units that you fear and prioritise the destruction of but to still be useful. Having them be able to chew through ten tanks and safe from harm is just cheap though.

I've tried setting it so that it requires a line of sight but can be ripple-fired at an area. After trying a three man team that can't fire from within buildings I think it is fairer if they are vulnerable as a one man team that can use buildings. I've upped the blast and armour damage but will drastically lower the number of overall rockets available. Four units firing five rockets each with two reloads for a 60 rocket total seems more fair than 200 rounds of wailing explosive doom. That and needing a line of sight and the fragility of one man seem a good balance. They can still utterly annihilate armour so I might tweak back down the blast and armour performance.

With the heavy mortars I'm thinking a battery of five mortars (off map) with 20 rounds each? Total of 100 rounds, requires line of sight. Have them need to cool down or "reload" every twenty rounds otherwise it'll be the nebelwerfer all over again.

#12: Re: Ardennes VetBoB for CC5 issues and changes. Author: Hicks,

Posted: Tue May 01, 2018 3:15 pm
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I've replaced the sound, portraits, medals etc and given vehicles and infantry distinct weapons e.g. the M12 GMC now has a 155mm cannon as opposed to sharing the German 150mm, flamethrowers are distinct between sides - things like that.

The penetration values have been changed for some weapons, along with their effective ranges. Mortars (excluding the 120mm/4.2") are crew served weapons and where I've had the space I've added in towed AT variants of guns with slightly faster reloads than the tank mounted versions. I think The 5cm PaK and the 12.8cm PaK were the two that missed out due to a lack of free slots. Weapon weights have been restored to closer to their real counterparts which has had the effect of making the AI troops faster and subsequently appear more aggressive.

I've ran into something of a problem? now though.

While looking at the force pools there are a couple of divisions: 8/4th, 12/4th, 22/4th and 39/9th which have UK forces combined with them. There are one or two divisions which specifically are labelled as having shared elements so I'm not sure if these listed divisions are *supposed* to have UK forces within them. The limited searching I've done on UK forces in the battle show them as pretty separate? XXX Corps exists within the files and I should have space to add the UK forces to this group instead and replace the UK forces in the US divisions with their counterparts once more turning it into the BAR and Sherman show Rolling Eyes

. Would I be right in thinking this is something that would need to be done though? Or were they mixed UK/US forces?

The Nebelwerfer continues to be tweaked as currently it is utterly devastating. It's set up at the moment as a spotter unit. They call in fire from a battery of 6 launchers that fire 5 rounds each with 2 reloads of rockets available. I'm not sure if there is a way to get it to fire its full salvo of 30 rounds in one burst that scatters though? as unless I'm mistaken there wasn't a way to fire off one rocket at a time with the Nebelwerfer? There is a burst fire function in the files, but the rounds all hit the same spot. If there's a way to scatter a burst that would be great.

That's not to say that the Nebelwerfer in its current guise doesn't present some interesting challenges. As soon as you realise there is one on the map you have to be incredibly careful otherwise it will brutalise whatever it chooses to fire at. Terrific to use if you have it though.

Any help with the mixed division issue would be great!

#13: Re: Ardennes VetBoB for CC5 issues and changes. Author: Nomada_Firefox,

Posted: Fri May 04, 2018 11:09 am
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Do you know how you are stealing the work from others?

Do not tell me how you could not ask me about edit my files...........I can be found easily.

And you have not my permission by this reason.

#14: Re: Ardennes VetBoB for CC5 issues and changes. Author: Hicks,

Posted: Fri May 04, 2018 1:33 pm
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First of all, I'm not stealing anything. I'm not passing it off as my own work but a mod of an existing mod - included in the thread title and where on this forum I have recognised the skill and dedication of the people that have made them, while looking to share what I have modified or made in the same spirit.

If there have been hurt feelings or misunderstandings then I apologise but that was certainly not the intention. I started playing this mod due to having a crash with the other Bulge mod for CC5. I found things I wanted to change and did so. If others would like to try them or use the sounds or images then it's good to share.

If you have objections then that is fair enough.

#15: Re: Ardennes VetBoB for CC5 issues and changes. Author: KG_Brandenburg, Location: Austin,Tx

Posted: Sat May 05, 2018 6:24 am
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Hicks wrote (View Post):

First of all, I'm not stealing anything. I'm not passing it off as my own work but a mod of an existing mod - included in the thread title and where on this forum I have recognised the skill and dedication of the people that have made them, while looking to share what I have modified or made in the same spirit.

If there have been hurt feelings or misunderstandings then I apologise but that was certainly not the intention. I started playing this mod due to having a crash with the other Bulge mod for CC5. I found things I wanted to change and did so. If others would like to try them or use the sounds or images then it's good to share.

If you have objections then that is fair enough.

ill chime in..
Dude.. you ignored proper unwritten protocol and just good ethical practice in not asking before you edit someone else files.. in almost if not all cases ppl wont care if you mod their files but they still deserved to be asked .. Its common courtesy to the community that you are apart of

that is all

#16: Re: Ardennes VetBoB for CC5 issues and changes. Author: Nomada_Firefox,

Posted: Sat May 05, 2018 2:26 pm
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Hicks wrote (View Post):

Before you had started to edit my mod as if it was your mod, you should have asked me.

Otherwise, you could make it at private, never publishing it. These are very old rules from all mods in the world. Of course, opinions from creators always are accepted as good.

#17: Re: Ardennes VetBoB for CC5 issues and changes. Author: Hicks,

Posted: Sat May 05, 2018 3:13 pm
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Nomada_Firefox wrote (View Post):

Hicks wrote (View Post):

And that is your fundamental misunderstanding. I have not presented it as my mod. Only as a patch/modification of an existing mod in the same manner as the medal and sound graphics that I have been working on.

Your other mistake is that while there are forms of etiquette, there are not rules regarding mods; unless those set out by the developer/publisher of the base game as part of the EULA.

I used to make texture mods for Morrowind, one day I saw them converted over and used in Oblivion, no one contacted me about this. I was flattered though that someone had wanted to use them and took the time and effort to match them up to the meshes they were using, they made them look better. You are more possessive, that's fine. If you have objections to an optional modification being made of your work then that's also fine and it will remain private. I'll upload the unit portraits, sound files etc as resources if people wish to use them/modify them as they see fit and your original work remains as it is.

#18: Re: Ardennes VetBoB for CC5 issues and changes. Author: southern_land,

Posted: Sat May 05, 2018 7:54 pm
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Nomada_Firefox wrote (View Post):

These are very old rules from all mods in the world. Of course, opinions from creators always are accepted as good.

Fuck me, Firefox thinks he's God! hahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

#19: Re: Ardennes VetBoB for CC5 issues and changes. Author: Nomada_Firefox,

Posted: Sat May 05, 2018 9:21 pm
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Yeah yeah, you show me the reasons because I do not go to publish more Close Combat mods at public, I will show the work but I will share them just for some small people. I do not go to make mods for be stolen, pissed and more.....

Have a nice day.

#20: Re: Ardennes VetBoB for CC5 issues and changes. Author: Ernie_M,

Posted: Sun May 06, 2018 3:30 pm
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It's hard to believe that people are arguing over games that are
antiquated and hardly played anymore.

I've modified many "Mods" to my preferances and made some maps
for others to enjoy. One map was used in "Close Combat Wacht Am Rhein"
and others were uploaded to another Web site without my permission or credit.
Did I complain? .....NO.

If you don't want your work modified, copied, stolen, etc., then don't put it on the Web!

Gentlemen, there are MORE important things in life to worry about!

Close Combat Series -> Modding Workshop

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