how long does the grand campaign go for?
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Close Combat Series -> Close Combat The Longest Day
#1: how long does the grand campaign go for? Author: DasHoff,  PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2009 10:58 pm
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it says 4 days, but surely it goes longer? i mean carentan was taken on the 13th of june, wasnt it?

does the campaign lead more inland, like original cc5? or does this new campaign just revolve around the initial couple of days at the beaches?
#2: Re: how long does the grand campaign go for? Author: mooxe,  PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2009 2:37 am
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Its only four days. If you want a longer campaign be prepared to spend days editing the campaign.txt file. So far nobody has made a longer campaign AFAIK.
#3: Re: how long does the grand campaign go for? Author: Tejszd, Location: Canada PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2009 3:22 am
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The 4 day campaign is long enough....

Each day has a night and 4 day turns, so 5 turns per day.

The 1st night turn has 8 Allied BG's and the number of Allied BG's can increase to 30. So if you average 15 BG's in battle per turn that will be 300 battles in the 4 day campaign.

At a minimum of 15 minutes per battle you will play approximately 75 hours....

There are 3 Operations for each landing area or you can play each map individually which is 75 battles....

It is well worth the money for the amount of game play!

Last edited by Tejszd on Tue Jul 07, 2009 6:15 am; edited 1 time in total
#4: Re: how long does the grand campaign go for? Author: schrecken, Location: Sydney, Australia PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2009 3:28 am
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One of the main complaints in the past was the exceedingly long campaign.

Mooxe was one of the loudest saying no one could ever finish those long campaigns, why can't we have shorter campaigns.

Of course, now that a , relatively, short campaign is made available he is one of the first to raise his voice in complaint... must be something in his genes!
#5: Re: how long does the grand campaign go for? Author: DasHoff,  PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2009 3:58 am
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ah ok cool. any tips for an allied player, like where i should attack to get the most points, etc
#6: Re: how long does the grand campaign go for? Author: schrecken, Location: Sydney, Australia PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2009 4:10 am
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Attack at all points.

Your original orders were to take all of the maps shown in the first 24hours.

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2101214
#7: Re: how long does the grand campaign go for? Author: mooxe,  PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2009 4:15 am
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I am just saying.... Its impossible to edit the campaign.txt easily, you really need to be a pro and spend a ton of time on it. I did try to make a longer GC with only two turns per day and 10 days long, thats 20 moves. This would of allowed reinforcements to arrive sooner. I dont need a history lesson. I just gave up after a few days, to much editing, too much troubleshooting..

Among the moddable features: ALL strat layer features, ALL campaign details including weather, turns per day, scoring, all support mission types for both sides and locations, battlegroup recycling, battlegroup retreat/disband, supply and much more!

Yeah everything dumped to a text file. Everyone has notepad.exe so everyone can now enjoy the limitless modding possibilities of the campaign system. Yeah right!!!!!!! Changing the amount of days was wayyyyyy easier the original way.

Ok so I did whine that nobody could finish the long GCs, its true, very true. But with CC5 you could make shorter GCs, you could make long and short. Now you guys come along and lock it down to short only. Well unless you recite klatu-verata-nikktu or something like that.

Quote:
It is well worth the money more the amount of game play!


I dont think anybody buys that 75 hours of game play for the low price of $39.99 is a deal, thats not how people buy games. Can we stop saying this over and over? If we were to compare that to others games, this game would be a complete ripoff. Matrix Games pricing is not set in how many hours you can play a game, nor the quality, the support.... its a business model and nothing else. Why try and justify it? You guys are smarter than that....
#8: Re: how long does the grand campaign go for? Author: schrecken, Location: Sydney, Australia PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2009 4:28 am
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It's a very deep and complex game Mooxe, that's what makes it the survivor it is.


You want it simple... but then it wouldn't be Close Combat but just a piece of fluff.


The data you refer too was not editable at all previously, now it is... that makes it simpler.


You could not edit ALL campaign details including weather, turns per day, scoring, all support mission types for both sides and locations, battlegroup recycling, battlegroup retreat/disband, supply and much more!.... now you can , stop whining.
#9: Re: how long does the grand campaign go for? Author: schrecken, Location: Sydney, Australia PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2009 4:31 am
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mooxe wrote (View Post):
Matrix Games pricing is not set in how many hours you can play a game, nor the quality, the support.... its a business model and nothing else. Why try and justify it? You guys are smarter than that....



Worth every cent I spent on it a million times over.
#10: Re: how long does the grand campaign go for? Author: Tejszd, Location: Canada PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2009 6:34 am
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Mooxe,

The 75 hours was just an example of the minimum time that someone could put in to the game for single campaign. The value though is in H2H and playing the campaigns/operations and trying different approaches.

For someone making a mod the options in the campaign.txt is what everyone wanted. Almost every setting that was hidden before is now available to be edited. Does it take effort? Yes it does. Is it easier than before when people had to hex edit files to change things? Yes it is.

The problem is there are very few mod makers today, not the options available or format of the files (edit: I do think a strat creation tool is still needed/missed by mod makers). It is the people with the desire to put in the effort required to make a mod other than a couple still working on finishing their CC5 mods started years ago (ex, CC5 Battle of the Scheldt by Buck) that is missing....

Last edited by Tejszd on Tue Jul 07, 2009 7:16 am; edited 1 time in total
#11: Re: how long does the grand campaign go for? Author: Ivan_Zaitzev,  PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2009 6:50 am
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If i counted correctly there are 63 maps right?
I dont have CCTLD but 63 maps and 5 turns per day looks great to me.
#12: Re: how long does the grand campaign go for? Author: Stwa,  PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2009 6:58 am
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CC is a graphics and data intensive game. Becuase of the campaign structure, deep testing is required whenever there are changes to campaign related data values. It takes more effort and money to develop this type of game and the testing cycles add to the expense.

I was always amazed when modders in the past would take on a CC5 project, many times, with very large project teams. Even for the mods the development cycle was long and tedius and successful projects were generally those that had competent management.

I am glad modding values have been moved outside of the exe. This is good programming in any event. But the fact of the matter, in the large scheme of things, modding a CC5 (now TLD) project from beginning to end is still a VERY time consuming process.

Few people today, have enough inclination or time to even "port" the existing mods from CC5 to TLD or even CCMT.
#13: Re: how long does the grand campaign go for? Author: Tejszd, Location: Canada PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2009 7:08 am
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I believe a couple of mod conversions are in progress;

Bloody Omaha
GJS
Meuse

Though little has been said or shown. Maybe they won't get done but they have been started....

For Meuse I will posts screen shots to prove it is possible but I will not commit to releasing it. As I still have changes I would like to make (ex. night turns, weather, support maps, etc. and I was going to add or change some maps but the map maker who said he would make them has disappeared). Plus I have put in a lot of effort already into mods and in being a beta tester on the re-releases so when I hear/read some of the comments/feedback I wonder why bother if people don't appreciate the re-releases....

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#14: Re: how long does the grand campaign go for? Author: Stwa,  PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2009 7:22 am
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Thats funny, hopefully the mods will be completed.

What's funny is I just recently downloaded Fortif, Houx, and Namur for my own West Front mini campaign in CCMT. This mod is already complete and operational in CCMT. It took about an hour. This time the Allies are crossing from left to right.

As I age, it's no longer about quantity anymore.

But, I still hope the big mods get ported to TLD for the sake of the community.
#15: Re: how long does the grand campaign go for? Author: DasHoff,  PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2009 8:59 am
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man i dont know how im supposed to take every map within the first 24 hours vs a decent player, but im gonna try. the whole exhaustion thing rages me, there have already been several instances where i couldve taken the map, but the battle ended due to exhaustion. or his force morale drops too far and the battle ends prematurely, when i was going to take the map anyway. i've just finished the night battles, we are on to june 6 now.

will my axis opponent get a chance to do any counter attacks at all? or is it just gonna be me attacking every square. i dont know if he gets an panzer units or not
#16: Re: how long does the grand campaign go for? Author: lemon42,  PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2009 10:24 am
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Tejszd wrote (View Post):
I believe a couple of mod conversions are in progress;

Bloody Omaha
GJS
Meuse

Though little has been said or shown. Maybe they won't get done but they have been started....

For Meuse I will posts screen shots to prove it is possible but I will not commit to releasing it. As I still have changes I would like to make (ex. night turns, weather, support maps, etc. and I was going to add or change some maps but the map maker who said he would make them has disappeared). Plus I have put in a lot of effort already into mods and in being a beta tester on the re-releases so when I hear/read some of the comments/feedback I wonder why bother if people don't appreciate the re-releases....


There are people which appreciate what you guys are doing so please don't worry to much and keep working on them !
#17: Re: how long does the grand campaign go for? Author: DasHoff,  PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2009 10:54 pm
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also does anyone have a definite answer for the effect of night? my opponent says it has a huge effect; its why ive been able to sneak up and flank him all the time. but im not so sure. should i rest my battlegroups during the night or keep hammering him? does resting bring cohesion back up?
#18: Re: how long does the grand campaign go for? Author: Tejszd, Location: Canada PostPosted: Wed Jul 08, 2009 1:10 am
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Night reduces how far troops can see so it does make it easier to sneak up.

Resting a battlegroup helps them recover cohesion & fatigue. Keep in mind both sides have to decide to rest or the enemy BG has to move away to get any benefit. If you are the Allies it is probably best to keep hammering away for the 1st day or two to get some space to allow reinforcements to land on the open beaches....
#19: Re: how long does the grand campaign go for? Author: DasHoff,  PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 12:39 am
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i have one more question. for some of the beaches it says dont worry about pockets of resistance to the south of the map, just clear the main points and let future units clean up. does that mean i can take the road out on the beach map, and therefore move my unit off the beach, letting the next unit to land on the beach finish the germans off?
#20: Re: how long does the grand campaign go for? Author: Tejszd, Location: Canada PostPosted: Mon Jul 13, 2009 1:24 am
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DasHoff wrote (View Post):
i have one more question. for some of the beaches it says dont worry about pockets of resistance to the south of the map, just clear the main points and let future units clean up. does that mean i can take the road out on the beach map, and therefore move my unit off the beach, letting the next unit to land on the beach finish the germans off?


Yes, as the Allies you want to push inland as soon as possible as it will allow follow up BG's to land and sometimes you will also cut off the supply line to the German BG on the beach making it even easier for them to be detroyed by the following BG....
Close Combat Series -> Close Combat The Longest Day


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