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Close Combat Series -> CC5 Stalingrad Der Kessel

#1: Der Kessel needs some serious changes! Author: Pzt_Crackwise, Location: Switzerland

Posted: Sat Jan 16, 2010 8:08 pm
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First of all I would like to thank pzjager for doing such a good job with this mod. I mean the maps are excellent, the sounds are terrific and the whole atmosphere takes you inside. But there are some issues which sadly ruin the gameplay:

1. Artillery, rockets, 122mm mortar are too powerful. If you have such assets in your BG you guarantee to make 10-20 kills without doing anything else.

2. The forward observers, artillery obeservers fire indirectly, like mortars. This makes them too powerful and seriously disrupts the gameplay. It would be much better if they were made to fire with direct LOS.

3. It is now a fact that infantry weapons' effectiveness have been reduced. But apparently ATG's are also tweaked to make them less effective. This ruins the game sadly. We are playing through the SDK GC with a friend of mine, i am playing as the russians, he as the germans. He has fired hundreds of shells with his pak40 to my t34 and kv1s but hasn't made a kill yet. Ok, t34 and kv are strong tanks but what about the inferior german tanks? As for the russians, I have fired on the pzkpfw IV and sturmgeschütz a lot of times with my 76.2mm ATG but wasnt able to destroy them. I mean I fired to the tank from 40 meters but the only result was immobilization.

4. Snipers seem to be awefully ineffective. I mean Stalingrad was the battle where lots of sniping took place and very famous snipers broke their records here. But most of the time if you fire to a team over a distance between 200-300m with a sniper, you will waste 40 rounds, and will make 2-3 kills maybe. And If the enemy is inside a building your sniper wont be able to snipe them, then he will make 1 kill probably. Weren't snipers effective in building to building skirmishes?

These mentioned above are the most important things which ruin the potentially awesome SDK. They undermine the tactical gameplay and are not realistic in my opinion. So pzjager if you are working on SDK 1.3 or a patch, I think it would be excellent if you took these into consideration. Then this mod would be perfect and definitely my favorite Smile

#2: Re: Der Kessel needs some serious changes! Author: Tejszd, Location: Canada

Posted: Sat Jan 16, 2010 9:23 pm
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Did you add the H2H submod?

CC5 Stalingrad Der Kessel was designed for single player against the computer as Russian.

Last edited by Tejszd on Sat Jan 16, 2010 11:10 pm; edited 1 time in total

#3: Re: Der Kessel needs some serious changes! Author: Pzt_Crackwise, Location: Switzerland

Posted: Sat Jan 16, 2010 10:09 pm
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Yes, we reached these conclusions on a H2H GC, H2H submod installed.

#4: Re: Der Kessel needs some serious changes! Author: ke_mechial,

Posted: Sun Jan 17, 2010 12:03 pm
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Yes I agree with him. I feel the same way about the armor of russian Tanks.

#5: Re: Der Kessel needs some serious changes! Author: flick,

Posted: Mon Feb 01, 2010 8:36 pm
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Did anyone ever get in touch with pzjager about the update?

#6: Re: Der Kessel needs some serious changes! Author: CC_CO,

Posted: Tue Feb 23, 2010 2:18 pm
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1. I dont agree in the fact that artillery and morters are too powerful. During WWII entire formations was wiped out by artillery and mortage barrages. Gameplay-wise, the destruction these weapons has in Der Kessel, makes you think one more time when moving BGs on the strategic map. Meeting engagement against a BG with powerful arty is really dangerous.

2. Forward Observers are powerful. I have already had heavy losses due to forward axis observers. So now im thinking twice before massing my men on those maps where i have to gain ground as the attacker, in order for my opponent not to contain me into a too little battlespace, where im more easily anahilated.

3. Well im also playing a H2H GC at the moment, as the Russians, and my opponent´s PAK 40, has taken out several of my T34s. Most of my KV1s hasent been destroyed by PAK fire, including from the PAK 40, however, the KV1-crews has been injured and the vechiles them selfs also dammaged, thus for most part lost after battle. A few has maybe been repped and send back to the forcepoll, although im not sure tbh?

4. Snipers, well, in some battles my opponents Axis snipers killed at least 5 of my troops, but i dont know if they are too underpowered, since i have used my own to sneak behind enemy lines, trying to find those dammed arty observers.

#7: Re: Der Kessel needs some serious changes! Author: kukov,

Posted: Sun Aug 08, 2010 10:06 pm
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Pzt_Crackwise wrote (View Post):

First of all I would like to thank pzjager for doing such a good job with this mod. I mean the maps are excellent, the sounds are terrific and the whole atmosphere takes you inside. But there are some issues which sadly ruin the gameplay:

1. Artillery, rockets, 122mm mortar are too powerful. If you have such assets in your BG you guarantee to make 10-20 kills without doing anything else.

2. The forward observers, artillery obeservers fire indirectly, like mortars. This makes them too powerful and seriously disrupts the gameplay. It would be much better if they were made to fire with direct LOS.

3. It is now a fact that infantry weapons' effectiveness have been reduced. But apparently ATG's are also tweaked to make them less effective. This ruins the game sadly. We are playing through the SDK GC with a friend of mine, i am playing as the russians, he as the germans. He has fired hundreds of shells with his pak40 to my t34 and kv1s but hasn't made a kill yet. Ok, t34 and kv are strong tanks but what about the inferior german tanks? As for the russians, I have fired on the pzkpfw IV and sturmgeschütz a lot of times with my 76.2mm ATG but wasnt able to destroy them. I mean I fired to the tank from 40 meters but the only result was immobilization.

4. Snipers seem to be awefully ineffective. I mean Stalingrad was the battle where lots of sniping took place and very famous snipers broke their records here. But most of the time if you fire to a team over a distance between 200-300m with a sniper, you will waste 40 rounds, and will make 2-3 kills maybe. And If the enemy is inside a building your sniper wont be able to snipe them, then he will make 1 kill probably. Weren't snipers effective in building to building skirmishes?

These mentioned above are the most important things which ruin the potentially awesome SDK. They undermine the tactical gameplay and are not realistic in my opinion. So pzjager if you are working on SDK 1.3 or a patch, I think it would be excellent if you took these into consideration. Then this mod would be perfect and definitely my favorite Smile

This is the best mod IMO

I agree with the Snipers and AT guns being on the weak side though. Also I often play this mod as the Germans and get really annoyed by the fact that the Russians sometimes just dont attack. They make a couple of feeble probes and then seem to totally freeze up leaving me in an awkward position having to assault them with weakened troops with hardly any AT capability in the open to force a conclusion to the battle. I think though this is mainly to do with the original games AI being poor. Anyone else experience this?

#8: Re: Der Kessel needs some serious changes! Author: dgfred, Location: N.C., USA

Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2011 3:40 pm
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I don't have much of a problem with AT capabilities. My problem is after a kill or two... the PAK (or anything killing Russian armor) is immediately pounded by Arty or Kats Shocked

. It makes you pick and choose whether you want the kill or that unit to survive. I like for my German sniper, if they have ammo, to fire on moving Russians temporarily making them go belly down at least for a moment. They are effective from shorter ranges, but like anything else, after a kill or two--- they better get out of there to survive.

#9: Re: Der Kessel needs some serious changes! Author: salhexe,

Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2011 5:23 pm
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If you ordered them to shoot you soon discovered, you have order to defend they will know when to hit and will have less chance of being discovered.

#10: Re: Der Kessel needs some serious changes! Author: dgfred, Location: N.C., USA

Posted: Thu Nov 10, 2011 8:37 pm
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Thanks for the tip salhexe Cool

.

By the way: I am STILL unable to download your BOB vetmod Crying or Very sad

. Every time I try the entire file downloads to my plugin file. For some reason I can not extract it without this happening.
I did not have any problems with all the SDK mods or submods. Any ideas?

#11: Re: Der Kessel needs some serious changes! Author: salhexe,

Posted: Fri Nov 11, 2011 9:24 am
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I tried right now and download work. It is a zip file, you install them manually.

I am currently working on version 3.6 for various improvements

Cheers

#12: Re: Der Kessel needs some serious changes! Author: dgfred, Location: N.C., USA

Posted: Fri Nov 11, 2011 2:51 pm
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I don't know if you remember, but I had the same problem several years back trying to download them from CSO... same problem now. I am a computer dunce, I'm sure I am just skipping or missing some part of the manual install... but I can't figure out which part. Embarassed

Close Combat Series -> CC5 Stalingrad Der Kessel

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