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Close Combat Series -> Close Combat 2: A Bridge Too Far

#16: Re: Scavenging. Author: Pzt_Kanov, Location: México

Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2010 6:06 pm
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OK, here's the trick to scavenging, once a well kept secret but I guess it doesn't matter now, and we all should get to know the intricacies of this fine game.

A soldier will scavenge when:

1.- He's near a dead body
2.- Said dead body had a weapon on his hands when he died, and this weapon had ammo.
3.- He is low on ammo on his primary/crewed weapon.
4.- And doesn't have another weapon left, including PzFausts, explosive charges, molotovs etc.
5.- His secondary weapon is on its last magazine or less if its a multiple shot per magazine weapon (other firearm).
6.- They pick up ammo of the same type of weapon they are carrying, provided that they are low on ammo but have more than a magazine left, otherwise if they are on their last magazine, they will pick another weapon

That's why soldiers that are out of ammo but left over dead bodies sometimes don't pick up anything, it's because they have other weapon there, the culprits are mostly close range AT weapons that never get to be used.

They do Pick up ammo, try with similar teams, say a recon team, deplete the ammo of one of them (not necessary to expend all of it) and send the other to die around there, the healthy team will pick up ammo if the criteria above is met. Write the number of rounds if you want.

Crewed weapons are kind of a wildcard, they can be passed around within a team not mattering any of the above (cc3 to cctld). For them to be picked up from the dead it can happen but it is very rare, I think personal weapons have priority.

Don't know if there's a limit to scavenging, some say they are limited to 3 scavenged guns (scavenge one waste its ammo, scavenge other etc).

Would be cool to scavenge Panzerfausts and other useful AT weapons, as it is now it is almost impossible because they are mostly single shot weapons and is very hard that a coincidence of killing a soldier while he is carrying a panzerfaust BUT with out him firing it is accomplished.

Last edited by Pzt_Kanov on Mon Aug 30, 2010 10:43 pm; edited 1 time in total

#17: Re: Scavenging. Author: squadleader_id, Location: Soerabaja

Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2010 6:34 pm
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Pzt_Kanov wrote (View Post):

OK, here's the trick to scavenging, once a well kept secret but I guess it doesn't matter now, and we all should get to know the intricacies of this fine game.

A soldier will scavenge when:

1.- He's near a dead body
2.- Said dead body had a weapon on his hands when he died, and this weapon had ammo.
3.- He is low on ammo on his primary/crewed weapon.
4.- And doesn't have another weapon left, including PzFausts, explosive charges, molotovs etc.
5.- His secondary weapon is on its last magazine or less if its a multiple shot per magazine weapon (other firearm).
6.- They pick up ammo of the same type of weapon they are carrying, provided that they are low on ammo but have more than a magazine left.

That's why soldiers that are out of ammo but left over dead bodies sometimes don't pick up anything, it's because they have other weapon there, they are mostly close range AT weapons that never get to be used.

They do Pick up ammo, try with similar teams, say a recon team, deplete the ammo of one of them (not necessary to expend all of it) and send the other to die around there, the healthy team will pick up ammo if the criteria above is met. Write the number of rounds if you want.

Crewed weapons are kind of a wildcard, they can be passed around within a team not mattering any of the above (cc3 to cctld). For them to be picked up from the dead I think personal weapons have priority, it can happen but it is very rare.

Don't know if there's a limit to scavenging, some say they are limited to 3 scavenged guns (scavenge one waste its ammo, scavenge other etc).

Thanks for the detailed intel, Pzt_Kanov! Nicely done!
I still think that for similar/identical weapons...the way the engine handles it...scavenging soldiers actually pick up identical weapon (incl. ammo and clips)...of course in the game stats you get the same results as picking up ammo and clips.
So either way, the way the aging CC4/CC5 engine handles scavenging is still pretty amazing.

Quote:

Would be cool to scavenge Panzerfausts and other useful AT weapons, as it is now it is almost impossible because they are mostly single shot weapons and is very hard that a coincidence of killing a soldier while he is carrying a panzerfaust BUT with out him firing it is accomplished.

It is possible...while playtesting Battle of Surabaya (status=on hold)...I've seen out of ammo Gurkha riflemen pick up Japanese Lunge Mines from dead Indonesian soldiers.
At first I didn't notice that they had run out of ammo...and sent them forward to take a VL...when they got there I was puzzled that the Gurkhas now carried "tridents" instead of rifles Wink

#18: Re: Scavenging. Author: Pzt_Kanov, Location: México

Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2010 7:12 pm
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squadleader_id wrote:

Did you made those soldiers carry those weapons only? I suppose if a soldier was carrying a pzfaust only and it gets killed you could potentially pick it up fairly commonly.

I still believe soldiers do pick up ammo from same weapon, will need some tests.

And yeah I agree, scavenging is amazing, and for me is one of the pinnacles of the CC code.

#19: Re: Scavenging. Author: Dauphin,

Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2010 7:27 pm
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A sniper with no more bullets change his weapon to use diiferent ammo

#20: Re: Scavenging. Author: Pzt_Kanov, Location: México

Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2010 7:45 pm
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Yeah, well, there aren't many scoped rifles available to scavenge in close combat battlefields, it is normal that they scavenge other weapons. But you're right it would be easier to test scavenging with snipers.

#21: Re: Scavenging. Author: Pzt_Kanov, Location: México

Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2010 10:06 pm
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Proof of ammo scavenging:

Set up a little custom battle in CC3, 60% ammo for both sides. Got one sniper to scavenge ammo from other dead sniper.

UO0002.jpg

Description:

Lehmann has 56 rounds starting the battle.

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UO0003.jpg

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Ossmann has 32 rounds starting the battle.

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UO0004.jpg

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Lehmann Killed

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#22: Re: Scavenging. Author: Pzt_Kanov, Location: México

Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2010 10:08 pm
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Cont.

UO0005.jpg

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Ossmann running to dead sniper, still has 32 rounds.

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UO0006.jpg

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Ossmann with 80 Rounds

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#23: Re: Scavenging. Author: schrecken, Location: Sydney, Australia

Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2010 10:33 pm
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nice

#24: Re: Scavenging. Author: squadleader_id, Location: Soerabaja

Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2010 11:47 pm
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Very nice demonstration, Pzt_Kanov! I'm sold!
So if soldiers do scavenge ammo...the original devs should have implemented ammo sharing between squad members Idea

#25: Re: Scavenging. Author: CSO_Talorgan,

Posted: Tue Aug 31, 2010 2:10 pm
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When I think on the number of times I've called a halt because I thought I was low on ammo ....

Embarassed

#26: Re: Scavenging. Author: papa_whisky,

Posted: Wed Sep 01, 2010 12:59 am
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If I am not mistaken crewed weapons can normally only be picked up by a similar crew who are out of ammo. Ammo sharing would be good to implement. Infantry men in sections often carry ammo for the automatic weapon, or mortar rounds for the light mortar etc. Section commanders are tasked to ensure that those low on ammo are topped up by others.

#27: Re: Scavenging. Author: mooxe,

Posted: Wed Sep 01, 2010 3:20 am
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papa_whisky wrote (View Post):

If I am not mistaken crewed weapons can normally only be picked up by a similar crew who are out of ammo. Ammo sharing would be good to implement. Infantry men in sections often carry ammo for the automatic weapon, or mortar rounds for the light mortar etc. Section commanders are tasked to ensure that those low on ammo are topped up by others.

Depends what type of crewed weapons then. I have never seen a mortar scavenged. I have seen a Panzershrek team pick up a Schweres MG42 though, this was CC5.

Anyone want to see if they can get a non-mortar team to pick up a mortar?

#28: Re: Scavenging. Author: papa_whisky,

Posted: Wed Sep 01, 2010 10:48 am
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I think I have picked up rounds from a dead mortar crew by a mortar crew, but that may be my fuzzy memory and over active imagination speaking.

#29: Re: Scavenging. Author: CSO_Talorgan,

Posted: Sun Sep 05, 2010 7:02 pm
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papa_whisky wrote (View Post):

Infantry men in sections often carry ammo for the automatic weapon, or mortar rounds for the light mortar etc.

Doesn't the game do this, after a fashion, by having enough men in a team to carry the load, even though the actual weight is carried by one man (which is why these teams string out so easily)?

#30: Re: Scavenging. Author: QM, Location: Australia

Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 11:36 am
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Murphy was colocated with a command group. Command group got wiped out, old Murph was outa rounds so scrounged a Sten. Very demeaning for a sniper let me tell you!!

Btw. He won the day for the team.

Murphy!!.JPG

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#31: Re: Scavenging. Author: schrecken, Location: Sydney, Australia

Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 11:40 am
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hmmm.. sten set on single shot... 180metres... right between the eyes.

Did he keep the sten for the next battle?

#32: Re: Scavenging. Author: QM, Location: Australia

Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 8:26 pm
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No. Looks like he picked up his own gat after the regroup.

#33: Re: Scavenging. Author: mooxe,

Posted: Wed Mar 02, 2011 5:18 pm
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I was playing TRSM with Pzt_Serk the other day. One of my shermans was knocked out, and the veh crew fled to the building adjacent to the wreck. They are not able to recieve orders in TRSM. While fighting in the chateau my regular infantry were all killed, and Serk made his way towards my tank crew. They stood fast for awhile inflicting casualties in hand to hand and very close quater combat. The last two survivors scavenged a thompson, and an MG42! Sadly, they died soon after. They were not in a good spot to use the MG42 effective but ciyld have inflicted kills if Serk came in the right direction.

#34: Re: Scavenging. Author: CSO_Talorgan,

Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 7:56 pm
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QM wrote (View Post):

Very demeaning for a sniper let me tell you!

Now let's not get uppity!

Even Simo Häyhä wasn't above resorting to a mere sub machine gun although he only killed 200 with it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simo_H%C3%A4yh%C3%A4

... and I'll just exit stage left before anyone cottons on to the contrast between a Sten and a Suomi...

#35: Scavenging in CC:WaR Author: Slon,

Posted: Wed Feb 29, 2012 7:03 pm
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In late CCs scavenging depends on intelligence and experience, I think. Look at gunner Deniz! It's Panzershreck from KIA AT team.

100%Scavenger.jpg

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Smart shooter!

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Close Combat Series -> Close Combat 2: A Bridge Too Far

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