Close Combat Series :: View topic

through

[^/[Print]\]
Goto page 1, 2 Next :| |:
Close Combat Series -> CC5 Stalingrad

#1: Stalingrad RA units Author: Dima,

Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2011 7:08 am
—
62nd Army, that defended the city, had following units on 11th of September 1942 just prior to the first German assault on city (13/09/42):

33rd GRD - 864men.
35th GRD - 454men.
87th RD - 1819men.
98th RD - 465men.
112th RD - 2297men.
131st RD - 2540men.
196th RD - 1004men.
229th RD - 192men.
244th RD - 3685men.
315th RD - 2873men.
399th RD - 565men.
10th NKVD RD - 8615men.
10th RBr - 1912men.
115th RBr - 4868men.
149th RBr - 4125men.
124th RBr - 3607men.
42nd RBr - 5032men.
9th MRBr - 1073men.
38th MRBr - 2370men.
133rd TBr - 1107men.
27th TBr - 1181men.

They were same low on equipment, f.e. 131st RD had only 14 ATR and 11 mortars, 196th RD had 6 ATR and 3 mortars, while 98th RD had 1 ATR and 0 mortars Smile

#2: Re: Stalingrad RA units Author: Manoi, Location: Brussels

Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2011 8:05 am
—
Great Dima.
Have you still the list of the BG's of the Stalingrad mod Vers 1.2 : just to compare...

#3: Re: Stalingrad RA units Author: Dima,

Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2011 4:38 pm
—
Hey Manoi,

That list is not exactly Stal 2 BG list, but the list of units 62A had to defend the city in early September.
No wonder that the Germans could push that fast through the city initially.

Btw, some of the strongest units in the list: 115th RBr, 124th RBr, 149th RBr and 315th RD - were defending the northern part of the city, including the Market, and were not used in the city thus are not represented in Stal mod.

#4: Re: Stalingrad RA units Author: tigercub, Location: charters towers

Posted: Sat Apr 23, 2011 11:52 pm
—
Are you planning to add the Molotov cocktail launcher Dima? i dont know how often they used them or what units had them but they were there.
or perhaps release the Soviet mine dogs.

the isea was simple a trained dog carrieng 7 kg of heavy explosives launched to the underbelly of german tank and other armoured vehicles. pretty bad for the suicide animal. Rolling Eyes

Soviets tested the AT dogs during the military conflict with Japan in 1939 quite successfully, destroying several Japanese light tanks.
In August 1941 Soviets had 10 army units of AT dogs (consisted of 4 companies till July 1942, later - of 2 companies. Each company had 126 dogs). Such At dog units also had AT rifles platoons and snipers for killing the missed dogs with explosives. The first action AT dogs saw during the battle of Moscow in autumn 1941, 28th unit of AT dogs destroyed 42 German tanks and 2 armoured cars during the battle of Stalingrad. In one battle 15 from 17 dogs could reached the German tanks.

till October 1943 (when AT dog units were disbanded) Soviet Army had 2 regiments of AT dogs and 168 separate units, battalions and companies of AT dogs. Taking into consideration such big amount of AT dog units 300 destroyed German tanks seems reasonable, even not enough for 2 regiments and 168 units (that means that every unit with hundreds dogs could destroy only 2 tanks in average, a very ineffective, I would say......If the info about 28th unit is correct - 44 destroyed German AFVs during one battle, that means that the majority of AT dog units was completely unsuccessful!)

In principle, this idea is very strange as Soviet Army had quite sufficient amount of infantry AT rifles during the battle of Moscow and Stalingrad and using good AT rifles against tanks seems for me much more effective, safety and cheaper than unpredictable dog with two AT mines.

Tigercub

#5: Re: Stalingrad RA units Author: Dima,

Posted: Sun Apr 24, 2011 5:30 am
—

Quote:

Are you planning to add the Molotov cocktail launcher Dima? i dont know how often they used them or what units had them but they were there.

yes, Ampulomet will be in new version Smile

Quote:

In principle, this idea is very strange as Soviet Army had quite sufficient amount of infantry AT rifles during the battle of Moscow and Stalingrad and using good AT rifles against tanks seems for me much more effective, safety and cheaper than unpredictable dog with two AT mines.

during tests PTRD couldn't disable SdKfz 251 although penetrated its engine 7 times.

#6: Re: Stalingrad RA units Author: Digs, Location: Ontario, Canada

Posted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 10:13 am
—
Looking forward to the new version, do you have a list of what will be improved?.

#7: Re: Stalingrad RA units Author: tripwire, Location: Florida - USA

Posted: Wed Apr 27, 2011 9:14 pm
—
Yes, I am also looking forward to this, Dima. Thanks for all your efforts!

#8: Re: Stalingrad RA units Author: CSO_Talorgan,

Posted: Sun Jan 29, 2012 5:36 pm
—

tigercub wrote (View Post):

the Molotov cocktail launcher

What was it like?

#9: Re: Stalingrad RA units Author: tigercub, Location: charters towers

Posted: Mon Jan 30, 2012 4:37 am
—
Dima how is it going?

#10: Re: Stalingrad RA units Author: Dima,

Posted: Sat Dec 14, 2013 9:48 am
—

tigercub wrote (View Post):

Dima how is it going?

digging, gathering information bit by bit, changing data files slowly.

By now have all the TOEs down to SMG for the RA units defending the city in September. So the RA BGs will be totally different with all new units.
Found alot of new info for the German units assaulting the city, so will not be generic heavy weapon and small arms like in v1.2 but new German BGs will have precise and detailed composition with all new units.
Added forward observes as they were really important during this battle.

Will post some pics of new BGs soon.

#11: Re: Stalingrad RA units Author: Drizzt,

Posted: Sat Dec 14, 2013 11:05 am
—
Hi Dima, just for curiosity, which is the difference between a rifle division and a rifle brigade?
In my “uninformed way of think” I thought that a rifle brigade was a small “offhanded” rifle division, but in the first post I have discovered that, for example, 115RBr had more than 4000 men and, a depleted (depleted right? I’m not sure) rifle division like the 229th instead continues to exist without become part of and offhanded rifle brigade (I repeat that this is what I thought, as personal supposition, about rifle brigades: I’m totally uniformed).

Drizzt

#12: Re: Stalingrad RA units Author: Dima,

Posted: Sat Dec 14, 2013 1:35 pm
—
hi Drizzt,

Rifle Brigade was a stop gap measure in 1941-42 when there was a shortage of artillery and not enough officer capable of commanding Rifle Division.
Rifle Brigade had a bayonet strength like half of RD but didn't have same artillery component, AT battalion, Engineer Battalion, supply units, etc so basicaly it was unable to act independable and needed support from higher formations.
In late 1942-1943 most of RBs were converted to RDs.

As far as I understand it was not a total manpower of 229RD but a bayonet strength so most of the rear units were intact. Anyway it was withdrawn for refitting same time.

#13: Re: Stalingrad RA units Author: dj,

Posted: Sat Dec 14, 2013 5:50 pm
—
The Germans and their collaborator allies had the initial advantage. But curious to know the RA troop strengths late in the campaign as they amassed huge reserves across the river to assemble the counter-attack. The RA was said to have well over 1 million in reserves...and the RA sustained 1 mil wounded/KIA casualties throughout the whole campaign.

#14: Re: Stalingrad RA units Author: Drizzt,

Posted: Sat Dec 14, 2013 5:54 pm
—
Thanks for the info Dima, now it's clear. And about your work on stalingrad mod of course I'm also looking forward to it.

Drizzt

#15: Re: Stalingrad RA units Author: Dima,

Posted: Sat Dec 14, 2013 6:13 pm
—

dj wrote (View Post):

The Germans and their collaborator allies had the initial advantage. But curious to know the RA troop strengths late in the campaign as they amassed huge reserves across the river to assemble the counter-attack. The RA was said to have well over 1 million in reserves...and the RA sustained 1 mil wounded/KIA casualties throughout the whole campaign.

By the end of Stalingrad battle the losses were roughly the same for both sides - over 1mln as KIA/WIA/MIA each side.

#16: Re: Stalingrad RA units Author: Tejszd, Location: Canada

Posted: Sat Dec 14, 2013 6:25 pm
—
An updated Stalingrad is eagerly awaited....

#17: Re: Stalingrad RA units Author: tigercub, Location: charters towers

Posted: Sun Dec 15, 2013 4:23 am
—
very much so! +2

#18: Re: Stalingrad RA units Author: tripwire, Location: Florida - USA

Posted: Sun Dec 15, 2013 4:48 pm
—
An update to Stalingrad would be greatly appreciated!!

Thanks for your continued work, Dima.

#19: Re: Stalingrad RA units Author: Dima,

Posted: Sun Dec 29, 2013 9:16 pm
—
Just to keep it going...

244 StuG Abteilung that was supporting 71.ID on 13.09.42 had only 6 StuG operational while 112RD+196RD which were against 71.ID had 6 ATR, 1 76mm and a couple of 45mm together.
Was it a coincidence that the Germans attacked the weakest units? Wink

#20: Re: Stalingrad RA units Author: Tejszd, Location: Canada

Posted: Sun Dec 29, 2013 10:50 pm
—
I would think it was good scouting not a fluke that the Germans main effort usually hit weak units and or the dividing line between units....

Close Combat Series -> CC5 Stalingrad

output generated using printer-friendly topic mod. All times are GMT

Goto page 1, 2 Next :| |: Page 1 of 2