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Hicks

Rep: 31.6
votes: 2


PostPosted: Thu Feb 15, 2018 10:56 pm Post subject: Having some problems porting a vehicle back into CC3. Reply with quote

I'm trying to port the rocket carrying half-track back into Der Ost Front for CC3.

I've been able to put in mortar batteries, replacing the lowest tier halftrack for the Germans and a conscript command unit for the Soviets. Seeing as they were infantry though it was a nice easy action.

I've extracted the textures from CC3 originals .zfx file. Renamed them to GWurf. Extracted the DoF tanks.zfx and added them to that folder then repacked it. I'm under 600 files in it so it should be ok?

I've got no use for the Ostwind AA tank so I'm replacing that with the rocket half track. Adjusted the vehicles, geteams and weapons files to add the rockets to the weapons file and the vehicle to the geteams and vehicles files, matching the vehicle, crew and weapon references as needed. If I set the unit to use another halftrack graphic then it works fine, weapons, movement, crew - all ok.

As soon as I change the texture reference to the added GWurf files in the vehicles file, then when trying to enter a battle screen the game crashes.

Is there something I am missing?

Thanks in advance.
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sample

Rep: 56.1
votes: 3


PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 8:17 am Post subject: Re: Having some problems porting a vehicle back into CC3. Reply with quote

Hicks wrote (View Post):
I've got no use for the Ostwind AA tank so I'm replacing that with the rocket half track. Adjusted the vehicles, geteams and weapons files to add the rockets to the weapons file and the vehicle to the geteams and vehicles files, matching the vehicle, crew and weapon references as needed. If I set the unit to use another halftrack graphic then it works fine, weapons, movement, crew - all ok.

As soon as I change the texture reference to the added GWurf files in the vehicles file, then when trying to enter a battle screen the game crashes.

Is there something I am missing?

Thanks in advance.


I don't recall exactly how the Ostwind AA tank was set in DoF, but, as far as i remember, it was a turreted vehicle, while the wurf was a turretless vehicle in original CC3 version. You should use a halftrack slot from Dof order of the battle, not a turreted slot vehicle.

also, try to rename the textures of wurf exactly how they were in original CC3, and use the same slot for team/vehicle as in defalt game

hope it helps

m's
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Hicks

Rep: 31.6
votes: 2


PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 5:05 pm Post subject: Re: Having some problems porting a vehicle back into CC3. Reply with quote

Thank you. I was able to replace the rocket carrier textures [changed to a Marder but retaining the rocket carrier filename] in the DoF zfx with the original textures then switch the second Marder to use the existing reference.

I'm just puzzled as to why the game would crash with the new textures added.

Thank you again!
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Pete

Rep: 105.3
votes: 12


PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 5:49 pm Post subject: Re: Having some problems porting a vehicle back into CC3. Reply with quote

Hicks wrote (View Post):
Thank you. I was able to replace the rocket carrier textures [changed to a Marder but retaining the rocket carrier filename] in the DoF zfx with the original textures then switch the second Marder to use the existing reference.

I'm just puzzled as to why the game would crash with the new textures added.

Thank you again!

If I understand you well it is not so much the adding of the graphics but the reference to the graphics that is causing the crash. Or perhaps the graphs were not saved as uncompressed 16bit TGA's? If you attach all relevant files to your post (will work when zipped) I can have a look for you if you like.


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Hicks

Rep: 31.6
votes: 2


PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 6:40 pm Post subject: Re: Having some problems porting a vehicle back into CC3. Reply with quote

Pete wrote (View Post):
Hicks wrote (View Post):
Thank you. I was able to replace the rocket carrier textures [changed to a Marder but retaining the rocket carrier filename] in the DoF zfx with the original textures then switch the second Marder to use the existing reference.

I'm just puzzled as to why the game would crash with the new textures added.

Thank you again!

If I understand you well it is not so much the adding of the graphics but the reference to the graphics that is causing the crash. Or perhaps the graphs were not saved as uncompressed 16bit TGA's? If you attach all relevant files to your post (will work when zipped) I can have a look for you if you like.

I got the tanks.zfx file from the DoF archive. Unpacked it using zfx tool.
I then got the tanks.zfx from CC3 original. Unpacked that also.
I took the relevant files for the rocket carrier: g251_ROK.nnh, g251_ROK.nsh, g251_ROK.znh and g251_ROK.zsh from the CC3 archive and put them to one side.
In the geteams, vehicles and weapons .txt files I replaced the 30mm AA cannon with the rockets, replaced the Ostwind AA tank with the halftrack and copied over the references from the CC3 files into the DoF data files. Weapon and vehicle ID's were changed to refer to the DoF files as opposed to the CC3 references.
When setting the unit hull graphic as another half-track, the unit would work.
When renaming the rocket carrier files from the CC3 archive and adding them to the DoF archive [and repacking the archive] I then changed the reference in vehicles.txt to match the changed name.
With those changes though the game would crash.
I've been able to overwrite the DoF rocket carrier files [changed in the mod to a Marder] with the original half-track textures. That does work in game.]

Honestly, I'm just puzzled why the game didn't accept the renamed files. I think I called them something like: gWurf.[insert extension here]

Thank you in advance for any suggestions. As it stands, the adjustments are working. It would just be nice to know why it didn't work with the textures added as additional files.



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Pete

Rep: 105.3
votes: 12


PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 7:00 pm Post subject: Re: Having some problems porting a vehicle back into CC3. Reply with quote

I have been working on a COI mod since the summer and found it very frustrating. The game will just ctd upon start up on the simplest of errors and leave you wondering what on earth you did wrong this time. If you have a simple reference in the data files incorrect, it will ctd. Like when you have ammo allotted to a weapon and the ammo type can not be fired by the weapon. With LSA and GtC you'd get a warning message upon start up and it would still work with the error.
Recently I did some graphics work, saved as 16 bit tga, and renamed the files in a different app. Turned out that that app changed the bit depth from 16 to 24...


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ScnelleMeyer

Rep: 169.7
votes: 11


PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 8:00 pm Post subject: Re: Having some problems porting a vehicle back into CC3. Reply with quote

I believe your problem lies with your new name for the rocket half-track graphics files.

IIRC the names are connected to the .exe in CC3 so changing vehicle graphics .tgas is OK, but you need to keep original file names from CC3 for those graphics.
F.I you can change in M4 Sherman graphics to replace the sdkfz251/1 but the naming of the packed tgas need to be the same as for the sdkfz251/1 it will replace.

This would also explain why you can use an existing, original cc3, half track graphics and not get a crash. - You did not change its graphics file name, so the .exe finds the reference is OK.
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Hicks

Rep: 31.6
votes: 2


PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 8:36 pm Post subject: Re: Having some problems porting a vehicle back into CC3. Reply with quote

ScnelleMeyer wrote (View Post):
I believe your problem lies with your new name for the rocket half-track graphics files.

IIRC the names are connected to the .exe in CC3 so changing vehicle graphics .tgas is OK, but you need to keep original file names from CC3 for those graphics.
F.I you can change in M4 Sherman graphics to replace the sdkfz251/1 but the naming of the packed tgas need to be the same as for the sdkfz251/1 it will replace.

This would also explain why you can use an existing, original cc3, half track graphics and not get a crash. - You did not change its graphics file name, so the .exe finds the reference is OK.

Interesting... what seems odd is that within the DoF tanks.zfx file there are new additions: gWWIND, gSTG4 and files for the Ostwind also. I'm guessing there is some issue with the names that are used for the textures and formatting them in a particular way.

Pete wrote (View Post):

Recently I did some graphics work, saved as 16 bit tga, and renamed the files in a different app. Turned out that that app changed the bit depth from 16 to 24...

I know that headache all too well. I was doing some tinkering with textures and UI elements for Quake 2 and had a right chew on trying to find the right .tga settings to use.

It's strange how some things work and others don't. I remember there was some puzzlement when making the sound mods that I'd managed to get the file to pack with 180 sounds. Maybe the game is friendly towards me when it comes to sound but I'm not that friendly with it that it'll let me add textures! :D

Thank you both for your help and suggestions. Now at least I can make a mess of the Russian countryside with mortar batteries and rocket carriers.



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ScnelleMeyer

Rep: 169.7
votes: 11


PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 8:50 pm Post subject: Re: Having some problems porting a vehicle back into CC3. Reply with quote

Cool screenshot!
Just a note: the correct German nomenclature for an 81mm mortar would be Granatenwerfer or for short Gr.W - But your choice ofc:)

Interesting that some vehicles in DoF uses different names than in the original - I might not be totally correct in my recollections then.. Or the modmaker actually edited those names into the .exe/.dll file. Now I want to find this out!

So, could you make the Rocket carrier work with my re-naming suggestion?
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Pete

Rep: 105.3
votes: 12


PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 9:03 pm Post subject: Re: Having some problems porting a vehicle back into CC3. Reply with quote

Ok, checked your files in Excel and you need to check the weapons file. There is an extra space added in that line (weapon 83) between the first column (vehicle name) and the second (Nation) so that the line is shifted 1 column across its entire length.


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Pete

Rep: 105.3
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 9:08 pm Post subject: Re: Having some problems porting a vehicle back into CC3. Reply with quote

ScnelleMeyer wrote (View Post):
Cool screenshot!
Just a note: the correct German nomenclature for an 81mm mortar would be Granatenwerfer or for short Gr.W - But your choice ofc:)

Interesting that some vehicles in DoF uses different names than in the original - I might not be totally correct in my recollections then.. Or the modmaker actually edited those names into the .exe/.dll file. Now I want to find this out!

So, could you make the Rocket carrier work with my re-naming suggestion?


I think it's Granatwerfer.
On the vehicle graphics names: my experience with CC5, LSA and GtC is that you can rename them and as long as you change all names correctly and the shadow names it should not have to be a problem (IIRC).


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ScnelleMeyer

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votes: 11


PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 9:09 pm Post subject: Re: Having some problems porting a vehicle back into CC3. Reply with quote

Good find Pete - And thats all it takes for CC3 to go BOOM - CRASH! Very Happy
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Hicks

Rep: 31.6
votes: 2


PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 9:13 pm Post subject: Re: Having some problems porting a vehicle back into CC3. Reply with quote

ScnelleMeyer wrote (View Post):
Cool screenshot!
Just a note: the correct German nomenclature for an 81mm mortar would be Granatenwerfer or for short Gr.W - But your choice ofc:)

Interesting that some vehicles in DoF uses different names than in the original - I might not be totally correct in my recollections then.. Or the modmaker actually edited those names into the .exe/.dll file. Now I want to find this out!

So, could you make the Rocket carrier work with my re-naming suggestion?

Good catch! I still need to change some of the names as they display on the UI and what their default names are set as. They can be a bit jumbled in general when looking through the files. Add onto that that I've been swapping in information from a number of different mods and things can get more confused.

I was able to get the rocket carriers to display with their original textures when directly overwriting. I'll still need to get their troop UI icon and the weapon icon for their rockets but they aren't really priorities. I really need to pull my finger out and get the medal icons, sounds and other odds and ends all packaged and uploaded. :)

It'll be interesting to find out how the Ostwind etc were added. I'm hoping that there might be a little increase in interest for the games since they got a re-release over at gog.
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Pete

Rep: 105.3
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PostPosted: Fri Feb 16, 2018 9:18 pm Post subject: Re: Having some problems porting a vehicle back into CC3. Reply with quote

ScnelleMeyer wrote (View Post):
Good find Pete - And thats all it takes for CC3 to go BOOM - CRASH! Very Happy


My place is littered with COI shrapnel.


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ScnelleMeyer

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 17, 2018 2:22 pm Post subject: Re: Having some problems porting a vehicle back into CC3. Reply with quote

Pete wrote (View Post):

I think it's Granatwerfer.
On the vehicle graphics names: my experience with CC5, LSA and GtC is that you can rename them and as long as you change all names correctly and the shadow names it should not have to be a problem (IIRC).


I think thats indeed the correct name for the 81mm mortar Pete.
About the graphics in the games after CC3/RTB/Marines you are right too, the naming is not bound up to the .exe, so new vehicles can be named whatever one wants.

I did a little investigating on this, comparing Stock CC3 to DoF mod.
All Hull graphics names are corresponding to a stock game name. There are some hull names that the mod-maker did not use:
gTurBase Not used
rM4        Not used
rPZIVF2 Not used
rT34ft Not used
rT34mr Not used
rTurBase Not used

Also the Class number or index number for original vehicles can be changed without a problem.

Regarding naming convention for turret graphics, it appears that they can be named anything:
There are 35 turret names in DoF that is not found in Stock CC3.
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Hicks

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 17, 2018 5:26 pm Post subject: Re: Having some problems porting a vehicle back into CC3. Reply with quote

I wonder why it requires existing hulls but can have newly named turrets...

It seems odd to think that we're still poking and prodding the game, twenty years later.

Then again, look at the work that has been done on Falcon 4.0! Very Happy
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ScnelleMeyer

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 17, 2018 6:08 pm Post subject: Re: Having some problems porting a vehicle back into CC3. Reply with quote

I have dug some more into this Hicks.

I have found no reference to individual vehicle names in the .exe or the .dll file.
So, the next thing that came to mind was the wrecks. - CC3 vehicle data does not contain a wreck reference like the later versions of the game.

- So how does the game know what wreck to display for each vehicle? - I believe the answer is in the WHeader file contained in the Wrecks.zfx.

I opened it in a hex editor and whitin is a reference to every original vehicle graphics name in the game. - This would be how the game connects vehicles to wrecks. Further it explains why turret naming is irrelevant and will not cause a crash and also why you can add guns at will with any graphics name as these does not require a wreck.

The number of wreck graphics seems to indicate that either there are 1 wreckgraphic for each country in each vehicle SAI category, or the game picks a wreck randomly from each countries wreckgraphics pool.

It might be obvious by now, but when we try to add a new vehicle with a new name for the graphics file, the game crashes cause it cant find its wreck as the reference is not there.
My idea at this point is that if one wants to change the graphics file name for a vehicle, the WHeader file need to be Hex edited accordingly, by changing or adding (Not tested yet) the name of the new vehiclegraphic to the reference list.


Last edited by ScnelleMeyer on Sat Feb 17, 2018 6:36 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Pete

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 17, 2018 6:29 pm Post subject: Re: Having some problems porting a vehicle back into CC3. Reply with quote

Excellent find SchnelleMeyer! You go beyond where others stop.


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ScnelleMeyer

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 17, 2018 6:42 pm Post subject: Re: Having some problems porting a vehicle back into CC3. Reply with quote

Thanks Pete, this is/was one of those CC mysteries that I just had to investigate some more.

I find it strange if someone did not find this out earlier, but it might just be one of those things that just was commmonly accepted: "Its referencing the .exe".

Now, if we are able to actually ADD more references into the header file by hex editing - The vehicle limit could be increased if necessary.

Edit: I will try contacting Mafi about the WHeader file - Maybe he has it decoded already.
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Pete

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 17, 2018 6:50 pm Post subject: Re: Having some problems porting a vehicle back into CC3. Reply with quote

I find this interesting because it might come in handy for my potential future COI mods.


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