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Are abandoned vehicles and guns lost or captured?

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FFL_cheesecake

Rep: 9.3


PostPosted: Tue Oct 17, 2006 8:27 am Post subject: Great idea... Reply with quote

a really great idea this mod about israelo-arab wars... I come to see the pix posted by mooxe.
So, can we have some more information on this CC3 mod :

- which war : 1948, 1967 six days war, kippour war ?
- progress
- units
- etc...

bravo Smile


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Nembo

Rep: 36.7


PostPosted: Tue Oct 17, 2006 1:28 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

A) Covers 1948 to 1982
B) Its done check the downloads.
C) It can only run CC5, CCM, or RTB maps

Check here for more info,
http://www.closecombat.org/forums/showthread.php?t=11526


-Nembo
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caribacey




PostPosted: Tue Oct 17, 2006 2:53 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

I am downloading the mod now. Am I correct in assuming that I need to download a map for this beta 2 mod?


SA_Acey
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Nembo

Rep: 36.7


PostPosted: Tue Oct 17, 2006 6:14 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

It comes with one RTB map and two CC3 Africa maps, along with one Op.


-Nembo
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Demiurg




PostPosted: Wed Oct 18, 2006 9:04 am Post subject: Reply with quote

Nembo wrote:
It comes with one RTB map and two CC3 Africa maps, along with one Op.


No! CC3VoT (beta2) includes 2 RtB maps (1000X1000 meter) and three CC5 "El-Alamein" maps (650X650 meter)

It is really new version (beta 2). The new version includes advanced .exe - file which "sees" the save scenario with huge maps 40x40, and also allows to place VL on all huge map. I also have made some changes to data. Also one more huge map is added and 10-day's campaign in 1973 on 2 maps is made.


Last edited by Demiurg on Wed Oct 18, 2006 10:26 am; edited 1 time in total
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Demiurg




PostPosted: Wed Oct 18, 2006 10:19 am Post subject: Reply with quote

It is a full readmi of the CC3 "Valley of Tears":

Close Combat 3 “ Valley of Tears ”

On May, 14, 1948, the United Nations proclaimed the foundation of the tiny Jewish state in Palestine - Israel. This very day, all Arabian countries announced a war to Israel till utter annihilation. Armies of Palestine, Syria, Jordan, Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Lebanon attacked Israel simultaneously from different directions. It seemed, Israel had no chances of rescue. And it seemed so many times again. Since then, during about 60 years war between Arabs and Israelis goes on in the Middle East. Each new armistice serves as a new war preparations.

In wars 1948-1982 Middle East became testing area of the newest weapon. USSR, the Warsaw agreement, the Great Britain, the USA, Germany, France sold weapon to one or another side. And sometimes both to Arabs and Israel simultaneously. All these weapons you will see in CC3VoT!

Despite of huge advantage of the Arabian enemies, Israel has managed to win, or, at least, not to lose in all these wars - in 1948, 1956, 1967, 1973, 1982. The mod CC3 “ Valley of Tears ” (CC3VoT) is devoted to these particular battles.

What is CC3VoT? It is the mod on the basis of Close Combat 3. CC3VoT are dozen kinds of weapon and combat vehicles of the period 1948-1982. The combat vehicles and weapon in this game are made maximum authentically. All Vehicles/Weapons - data are carefully calculated. While working out the mod, the program code for Close Combat 3 has been changed! Due to this, CC3VoT works with huge maps - 1000x1000 meters ("RtB-size", 4800X4800pix)!!! Any other game of Close Combat series (CC1, 2, 3, 4, 5) does not allow fighting on such big maps. CC3VoT are tank fights on a distance more than 1000 meters; these are heavy mortars and the rocket weapon. CC3VoT are air strikes of aircraft and helicopters, anti-tank missiles, recoilless guns, amphibious tanks and many other things. Having in your force structure amphibious vehicles, you can easily cross water obstacles and attack an enemy on the other bank at once!

Big maps CC3VoT allow bypassing the opponent imperceptibly from flank. Even AI does miss such opportunity!

Many Close Combat fans have no CD with CC3. The game is very old and for a long time was not reissued. That’s why CC3VoT is created as independent game from CC3. What does it mean? CC3VoT is made as self installing program. You don’t need to make preliminary full installation of normal CC3, like in other mods. CD with CC3 is not necessary to start CC3VoT. Download CC3VoT auto-installer, start it, follow the instructions of the installation master – and the game will be installed itself. Open the folder with the installed game and start CC3VoT.exe.

CC3VoT includes huge MMCC-campaign since 1948 till 1982. You can battle on a strategic map of the entire Middle East. You can change a history course and crush Israel, or vice versa, to surpass Moshe Dayan or Israel Tal in their art of tank war. You can capture the whole Israel or, on the contrary, reach Cairo, Alexandria and Damascus …

To play MMCC-campaign - RUN SERVER.EXE FIRST!!!

1) Map and units are being saved. So every time you start MMCC3 your previous units will be restored.
2) Run the MMCC3.exe - select player name and side if you have not done it before.
3) First you need to connect to the server. Type in the TCP address and port number. Press Connect button.
4) Click on any sector. You will notice map name appear at the bottom.
5) Maps are picked at random.
6) Select "front line" sector controlled by opponent. (Notice "Attack/Defend sector" button will become enabled).
7) Press "Attack/defend" button. Press "Play AI"
Cool Now start CC3VoT. If you are playing against AI play MMCC3Op saved game. If you are playing against human go to multiplayer, start hosting game, select MMCC3Op saved games and wait for opponent to connect.
9) Play it until you or opponent lose control of a map. PLAY JUST ONE MAP. DON'T play other maps! As soon as you or opponent looses control of the map exit finish the game. This is very important! You may play multiple days/games on the same map
10) Now switch back to MMCC3 app. Press OK on the message box.
11) MMCC3 will extract your and AI units and save them. Map will be updated. You may loose or gain control of the sector.
12) Now do step 7.

Attention: do not install CC3VoT in a folder where CC3 has been installed earlier! If both CC3 and CC3VoT are installed simultaneously in your system, only CC3VoT will work without CD. Do not expect that standard CC3 or others mods can work without CD! If CC3 is already installed in your system, you can refuse the offer of the CC3VoT installation master to enter some changes to the register in your computer. If only CC3VoT is installed in your system, you must accept the offer of CC3VoT installation master to enter the necessary data in the register at the end of installation of CC3VoT.

If at start of the scenario editor there is a error, it is necessary to leave all over again for the main menu, then to choose " play a game ", then again to leave for the main menu and choose " Create " (scenario editor).

Here is CC3VoT - beta. The game contains only two big map 1000x1000 meters for one historical combat and one historical campaing (two huge map and 10 day in 1973) three maps of normal size for MMCC3VoT - campaigns. However you can easily create your own scenario of battles 1948-1982. Game contains all necessary historical kinds of weapon and vehicles. Use any CC5 or RtB maps. Do not use CC3 maps. CC3VoT does not work with maps CC1, 2, 3, 4!

If you have liked CC3VoT, I shall add the game with Map-pack and campaigns. I have not included them for the place economy to make CC3VoT-beta maximum compact and accessible for download.

If someone wants to help me with work on Close Combat 3 “Valley of Tears”, I’ll accept any help with pleasure.

Demiurg



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Last edited by Demiurg on Wed Oct 18, 2006 5:56 pm; edited 1 time in total
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squadleader_id

Rep: 53.1
votes: 7


PostPosted: Wed Oct 18, 2006 10:20 am Post subject: Reply with quote

Great job on the mod, Demiurg!
I've tried out the mod (I'm gonna play some more on the weekend)...looks great and the new units and graphics are awesome. One thing though...I've noticed that the AI is really weak? (I know CC AI was never briliant in the first place) I'm playing as Israelis and the Arabian infantry and tanks seem to just wander around in the first 10 min or so...and then charge blindly the VLs near the end when time runs out (playing 15 min battles).
The didn't charge earlier even after they knocked out all my tanks.
Could the AI be 'confused' because of the big maps? CC AI is known to perform poorly on large maps, right? Is CC3VoT geared more towards H2H play?

One more thing, will you be releasing a full-blown mod with more maps, ops, battles? Looking forward to this man!

Thanks in advance!
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Demiurg




PostPosted: Wed Oct 18, 2006 10:41 am Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, you are right! AI in CC3 it is really weak! But I think, that it does not depend on the size of maps. I even think, that on the big maps it is more difficult to player to win AI. I have noticed, that on big maps AI escapes not so frequently, as on small maps. Thus, AI tries to bypass your forces from flank and rear. The big map allows it it! I always try to ofensive against AI. To defend against AI it is not interesting. I think, that the big map to grasp much more difficultly than small because it is difficult to be in time everywhere to break resistance of the enemy on a huge map for 10 minutes.
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Massimof




PostPosted: Wed Oct 18, 2006 11:05 am Post subject: wow! Reply with quote

really a great idea...only an executable to run the installation!

and what about the big maps? now one may have a tank-vs-tank fight
not only at a close range but also at a "normal" range...

many thanks for your work, hope to see new maps/ops asap...

ciao
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Demiurg




PostPosted: Wed Oct 18, 2006 12:16 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank for kind words! Smile

I for a long time dreamed of the big maps in CC3. I love tank battles on the big distances. The Arab-Israeli Wars are the great tank fights which are not making a concession to tank fights WW2.

Its War Tank vs Tank!
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squadleader_id

Rep: 53.1
votes: 7


PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2006 12:43 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

I've been playing the mod a bit. Played the Ops and created some custom battles. I know this is only a beta...and a fine job also...but here's some early gameplay report.
Besides the AI acting more moronic than usual, I've noticed that infantry will always try to engage tanks!...even using small arms fire. When a tank comes into LOS...infantry teams will fire using rifles and assault riffles...doing no damage to the tank of course and in the process giving away their position.
Even on ambush infantry will start engaging tanks with small arms fire...even teams with no AT weapons left.
Also, infantry on defend tend to fire hopelessly at far away tanks...ignoring (softer) infantry targets closer to their position.

Good fun though...a nice change from WW2 action.
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Demiurg




PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2006 3:28 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

squadleader_id wrote:
I've been playing the mod a bit. Played the Ops and created some custom battles. I know this is only a beta...and a fine job also...but here's some early gameplay report.
Besides the AI acting more moronic than usual, I've noticed that infantry will always try to engage tanks!...even using small arms fire. When a tank comes into LOS...infantry teams will fire using rifles and assault riffles...doing no damage to the tank of course and in the process giving away their position.
Even on ambush infantry will start engaging tanks with small arms fire...even teams with no AT weapons left.
Also, infantry on defend tend to fire hopelessly at far away tanks...ignoring (softer) infantry targets closer to their position.

Good fun though...a nice change from WW2 action.


Yes, really, the infantry in CC3VoT shoots on vehicles and even on tanks!
It is made for the greater realism. In the present I fight infantry will not ignore the tank! The infantry will shoot at the tank from all weapon.
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squadleader_id

Rep: 53.1
votes: 7


PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2006 6:12 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

OK...but I have to disagree about the realism thing. Shooting at tanks with rifle bullets is just hopeless and unnecessary. Also, it makes the infantry behave strangely. Let's take a Super Bazooka 2 man team, if they're engaging a target (tanks/vehicles) the man with the zook will aim and shoot at the tank...that's normal...but his partner will also keep shooting at the tank with his rifle...that's not realistic.
A MG team on defend mode will fire at tanks...giving away their position.
You can't send out infantry teams to scout ahead and locate enemy tanks...then wait for friendly tanks to arrive...once they see a tank, infantry teams will start shooting recklessly at it...and probably end up KIA by the time friendly tanks arrive in the area.
Actually, from my early sessions playing CC3VoT, it makes infantry more vulnerable as they always shoot at tanks (without a chance of damaging the tank) and end up getting wasted by the tanks they were shooting at.
The bad thing is...say you want a recon squad to capture a VL...if they have LOS to a tank on the way they'd start shooting at the tank...instead of trying to slip past the tank...capture the VL and then find some place to hide.

Just my 2 cents.
Still addictive as hell this mod...and I need to learn modern squad warfare tactics Razz .

As for modern tank vs. tank battles...IMHO the CC engine is more suited to WW2 style 'close combat' tank battles...up close and personal! With these modern tanks with long range weapons capabilites...the engine just isn't suited to it. What I mean is with long range tank duels...you can't see all the action. You either choose between watching your own tanks firing at the enemy...or watch the targets you're shooting at. There's no option to say display the targets in an inset window (maybe CC6 should have this feature Idea ).

Demiurg, I still commend you an amazing looking and very well designed mod...and I anxiously await the map packs and ops/battles packs.
See you on the battlefield my friend! Smile
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Demiurg




PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2006 8:33 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

Everything, that you speak, it is absolutely correct! However as the statistics of real battles shows, in tanks few shells and huge quantity of bullets of the most different calibre get. When there is a true fight, the infantry shoots on the noticed tank from all weapon. The tank is a terrible steel monster. And the infantry will desperately shoot at it to damage its sight or devices of supervision. It seems to me, that it is simple while unusually for you. It is new game. Two my friends - skilled players CC. However when they have connected for game through a network, they behaved in 1973 as inexperienced beginners! They used tacticsWW2 and both have had huge losses. Completely new weapon demands completely new taktics of fight and a habit.
Moreover! In CC3VoT tactics should vary all time! 1948, 1956, 1967, 1973, 1982. In each of these wars the tactics. And that it to understand, it is necessary to battle H2H. It is impossible to use same tactics for example in 1967 and 1973. It will lead to to defeat.
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Ryz

Rep: 13.9


PostPosted: Sun Oct 22, 2006 5:42 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

Demiurg,
For ZSU RSR's ZSU weapon better represents short burst attacks than non-stop MGs. It takes over the other battlefield sounds too.

Для ЗСУ оружие подобранное в RSR1.0 ближе симулирует атаки мелкими очередями. Также ЗСУ сейчас забивает звуковой эфир.
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poli




PostPosted: Mon Oct 23, 2006 5:53 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

Intresting mod, good work.
Although i would agree that Infantry firing away at a tank over long distances is just suicide, be it 1948 or 2008 Infantry just WONT do that .(up close is different...)

I like the Heli and Mirage spotters,but as allways you cannot place them in Buildings making them somewhat inefficient.

The BIg maps (the one included and some maps from Battle of Berlin that i added ) are buggy! The main issue being that the "deployable" area is heavly distorted,I get gaps in the "dark areas". with some VL's I placed actually changing hands at the start of maps, AND despite capturing them they change back at the start of the next battle..

There is an Israely "heavy armourd combat vechile" that looks like a vehicle when you select it, but when you play all you get is a squad of men...


One last thing; How do i UNINSTALL this mod...??


"What is your major malfunction ?????"
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Demiurg




PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 2:39 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

Ryz wrote:
Demiurg,
For ZSU RSR's ZSU weapon better represents short burst attacks than non-stop MGs. It takes over the other battlefield sounds too.

Для ЗСУ оружие подобранное в RSR1.0 ближе симулирует атаки мелкими очередями. Также ЗСУ сейчас забивает звуковой эфир.


Yes, you are right. A sound at ZSU little bit extreme. It is a little unpleasant, but actually this gun gives short burst from 15 shells. Long burst - from 50 shells. The unpleasant sound arises because of a plenty of explosions. ZSU - actually is a fiery squall.
But I shall think how to find the reasonable compromise.
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Demiurg




PostPosted: Tue Oct 24, 2006 2:45 pm Post subject: Reply with quote

poli wrote:
Intresting mod, good work.
Although i would agree that Infantry firing away at a tank over long distances is just suicide, be it 1948 or 2008 Infantry just WONT do that .(up close is different...)

I like the Heli and Mirage spotters,but as allways you cannot place them in Buildings making them somewhat inefficient.

The BIg maps (the one included and some maps from Battle of Berlin that i added ) are buggy! The main issue being that the "deployable" area is heavly distorted,I get gaps in the "dark areas". with some VL's I placed actually changing hands at the start of maps, AND despite capturing them they change back at the start of the next battle..

There is an Israely "heavy armourd combat vechile" that looks like a vehicle when you select it, but when you play all you get is a squad of men...


One last thing; How do i UNINSTALL this mod...??


Yes, these problems to me are known. But it only beta! It is very difficult to make such serious changes to a program code. Not all turns out ideally. But I work above it. The problem of mine beta is to show new opportunities CC on the big maps and new to the schedule of the vehicles, the new weapon and new units.

To uninstall CC3VoT, simply remove a folder with game.
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handal0




PostPosted: Sun Jan 28, 2007 4:49 pm Post subject: CC3VoT Reply with quote

Fantastic MOD! Especially the range of weapons and the way the large maps allow not just flanking but also small unit infiltration.

Yes the Zsu is TOO LOUD and takes over, but seeing as the hatred the infantry have for these types of systems and the destruction they cause is well reported from the lebanon to 2para in the falklands so perhaps you have the phsycological impact of "oh crap where the hell is that coming" spot on.

Desperate infantrymen aside, does my super-bazooka loader (him with the bolt action) always have to `ping their position to the T55,etc while leaving the operator to load and aim on his own invariable getting them both blown away! Surely any sane operator would brain the prat with the tube? Is there something you have against American bazooka`s - a very Russian RPG thing perhaps?! Or was this actually a range finding practice as with the equally suicidal British LAW? Makes you wonder why people bother fighting wars!

I find the game exits and asks me for the CC3 cd just as I have won the 2nd Operation of the Campaign. It then says it could not load a german victory file. Is this my install or a known bug?

Any news on the full with maps version? I`d happily offer any assistance I could give just as long as you know that it took me half an evening just to get the El Alamein mod working! Thankfully , however, I do finally have a reliable 8Meg broadband connection so lotsa data not o problem.

Thanks again for a great mod,

handal0 [at] toucansurf [dot] com
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