Posted: Tue Jan 18, 2005 11:38 am Post subject: Infantry-Tactics
Hello !
I've got a question about Infantry-Tactics. How do you use Infantry in forests ?
I ask because i havent fought may battles in forests so far. Only 4 or 5 times i tried it and lost every time absolute clearly.
No Matter which Units i use (germans with k98 schiessbecher or Allied troops without): my men always get killed very quickly and do not inflict any remarkable damage on the opponent.
So is there anyone who can give me some rules or hints how to improve the effecitvity of my infantry-units in forests ?
I also take personal messages if u dont want to get this public
Nothing "not to get public" here mate. There is actually very little written or talked about as far as tactics in CC goes compared to other rts games. That doesn't mean there is less need for tactics in CC though. Quite the opposite.
Perhaps it's just chance you have lost your "forest firefights" and if you play them abit more you will experience different outcomes. The basics should not be any different than any fighting outside the forrest. You still need superior firepower to gain the advantage needed to manouver or destroy your enemy. Fighting in forests in CC seems to me alot like fighting on open ground without cover. Even if there is any cover advantage in the forest your opponent also has it wich makes you both equally with our without cover.
Perhaps you've not utilised all you firepower in the most proficient way? Perhaps you've had a contact with one team and have failed to give that team proper firesupport fast enough? And your supporting teams arriving to late got flattered one by one? Make sure you always have a solid base of fire when manouvering in forest enviourment. Move in short bounds since there are no obvious cover positions. As soon as you get a contact make sure you have superior firepower! Get all available teams into fireingpositions. This might be a bit tricky in the forest with all the trees and the not always so intelligent AI. You have to micromanage a lot. If you don't have superior firepower leave! Perhaps that is the simple answer why you've lost you previous encounters? Your enemy simply had more men(or more more "firepower" ie. MGs etc) and the battle was lost before you even started. Perhaps a fighting retreat was the answer? Getting your exposed teams out of harm and placing them further back in better positions that can be reinforced by other teams farther away.
I find that knowing when to retreat is quite an art. Many engagements are settled already from the start. If you can't win leave! Choose the place of battle. Know when to fight and when not to!
And it doesn’t matter all that much which troops you use. Three rookie MG teams still pack one hell of a punch against one "elite" unit.
I think the solution is a bit more "quality with the quantity" instead of "quantity with the quality".
Hope this helps at least a bit.
I'd say forest fights differ quite a bit from fighting out in the open. In a forest the line of sight is usually very short. That means you'll see your opponent only when he's already very close. Usually the side with the most firepower will win under such conditions. So deploy teams with lots of submachineguns and rapidly deployable MG's. An SMG-team will usually win the battle against a rifle team in close quarters.
In very open terrain the opposite is true. Rifle teams have can use their long-range accuracy there, and will make short work of SMG-teams that are out in the open.
What i do is just to move my men forward in short bounds. Also, never tell your men to move fast in a forest, unless you know that there are no bad guys there. Also, make sure you have a mortar/tank/any other heavy weapon that makes booms ready to fire on the enemy. The more the better. This way you can suppress them. Then throw smoke and either retreat or if you think you can win rush them. Good luck!
When fighting through woods I move forward in short bounds while keeping other close by teams on defend. Flamethrowers just seem to be better in woods. You have to get very close to the enemy and even still LOS is never quite bright green which means your FT wont get supressed as easy... have them fire on target or force fire towards the closest point to the enemy and you should score hits and get major supression on the enemy.
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Forests are a good opportunity to outflank your enemy. The limited los means you can often get a fast moving team like recon or rifle around a pinned down enemy. When a team is fired on from 2 sides their morale drops like stone.
Woods Clearing/Forests are a bitch in real life and very casualty intensive. I once took part in one using MILES gear and our 40-man platoon was torn to bits by a section-minus enemy. At the far end of the woods only eight men came out, with a corporal being the senior man.
In the game, as in real life, there is really only one way to handle it. Quick frontal rushes, utilising lots of smoke. Clearing a wooded area calls for the platoon/company to move in something approximating an extended line. Local flanking attacks might be possible, but only by units that are travelling along the edge of the woodline. Combat ranges are so reduced that any unit trying to rush out ahead (or to a flank) runs the very real risk of being eliminated in a surprise ambush. My recommendation, use your rifle sections to clear the woods in extended line. Keep MGs and other support weapons immediately behind the clearing troops. This will let them close up quickly at first contact. At each contact, use the riflemen to engage the enemy, while the nearest support weapons crawl forward. Once these have engaged, let them win the firefight and use the riflemen to rush the enemy, using their smoke grenades and mortar smoke to obscure the attack.
rilfe grens, flamers and piats rule.
mortars and smgs are good too, just like in all other close-quarters fighting.
dunno bout schrecks.
when using rifle grens, be aware that a green los doesnt necessarily mean that the guy with the rifle grens has los, maybe its just some other dork.
leute, die viel schreiben, schreiben häufig viel unsinn.
Posted: Fri Jan 21, 2005 11:56 pm Post subject: mmm
hey running man i have seen ur progress up the ladder!
maybe u should be giving infantry tips!
Forget words,actions will show your true ambitions!The Battlefield,In many cases, the terrain of a battlefield can be the best resource a commander has. A clump of trees, an abandoned house, or a drainage ditch can all be powerful tools in the right hands
Have to add my $0.02 to this armchair general convention.
In woods: short los; ergo, stick together! Don't go in with a single unit unless you've accounted for nearly all the enemy's units. Take at least three, one bieng a command squad. keep them in mutal support, or nearly so, at all times. and, as has been said, move in short bounds, even tree-to-tree. Forget tanks, they'll be sitting ducks, especially as Allies (maybe a flame Bren carrier).
It's a good thing that mortars and arty don't mimic tree bursts in woods; it would be too horrible to look upon the result.
a little trickk i like to use, if you see aan enemy team sprinting for some cover, een if they are in cover. try to hit them with a mortar shell. because they are standing up they are open, even in buildings and shrapnell is devastating. i once got nine guy's with one 81mm shell. it also makes them crawl, thus slowing them down.
What they said....
with a PzIII or Stuart in close tow (about 20-30m back) to support your squads once they're engaged.
A PzIII or Stu is the perfect tank killer too, if your opponent happens to bring his Sherman or PzIV into such unfavorable terrain.
Oh yea.... this is an infantry tactics thread. Okay, well how about tank supported squad infantry tactics?
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